715 Burpees, Thyroid Cancer & the Healing Power of Touch: Stephanie Thaler on Adhesion Release, Ketamine & the Body's Capacity to Heal

WELCOME TO EPISODE 294

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Stephanie Thaler (00:00.696)
So either from overuse, injury, or weakness, our body gets to a place where it doesn't have the capacity to handle the load that we're trying to put on it. And so to compensate for that, the body will lay down collagen to try to strengthen or hold the area and give it more capacity that it needs to be able to do whatever it is that we're trying to do. And so that collagen forms these adhesions.

And sometimes in that adhesion, the nerves can get entrapped. And so a lot of techniques just focus on adhesions of the muscle tissue, which can be effective. But when the nerves are entrapped in there, I mean we have seven trillion nerves in the human body. And when they get entrapped, like I said, it can cause some major problems for people.

Freddie Kimmel (00:50.572)
Welcome to the Beautifully Broken Podcast, where healing meets high performance. From cancer recovery to wellness technology, we bring you real stories and real innovators to help you reclaim your biology and build your personal blueprint for health. Let's go.

Freddie Kimmel (01:13.304)
Friends, welcome to the show. Before we get into things, I want to talk about your cells and how they run on light. This is not a fancy metaphor we're doing at the top of the show. Red and near infrared light penetrates deep into the tissue. It supports circulation, recovery, and cellular function at the source. Athletes use it. Our Olympic team has it in its training center.

Physical therapists use it. It's backed by peer-reviewed research you can find right now on PubBed and NIH through studies on human beings, not animals. Light Path LED was built by a veteran who discovered that red light therapy was beneficial during his own recovery from peripheral neuropathy. And when he built the panels, he refused to cut any corners. He used the three wavelengths, six seventy, eight ten, and nine forty nanometers.

Which are supported in the literature. He used pulsing from zero to nine thousand nine hundred and ninety-nine times per second. And he also added a five-year warranty on every panel system that is the longest in the industry. I want to give you guys some radical candor here. I'll never try to tell you this is the best panel. I think that's really hard for anybody to prove or argue about their system. What I can tell you is that this is the best value in the red light therapy market, full stop.

Mostly for the service, the support, the warranty, and the backed by science system. So whether you're looking for a panel for your home or you're a practitioner looking for something that fits your med spot or clinic, Lightpath LED has a great solution. You can go to lightpathled.com and you can find real wavelengths, real quality built panels, real results, and you can use code Beautifully Broken for a discount. Check them out in the show notes.

All right, team, let's be real. When your immune system goes down, everything in life feels harder. That's why I use silverbiotics and I keep it in my cabinet and my travel bag. It's not hype, it's nano silver technology, backed by science and proven to support immune function. Most importantly, hear this without wrecking your gut like antibiotics. This is fast-acting, broad spectrum immune support you can take every day.

Freddie Kimmel (03:33.838)
And you can trust it when life hits you hard. I've used this in travel, under extreme stress, even post-surgery, and it's always come through. There's no resistance buildup and there's no nonsense. It's just clean, simple support when you need it most. So you can use code Beautifully Broken for a generous discount in the cart at silverbiotics.com because nothing feels better than knowing your body is ready. Let's go.

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Beautifully Broken podcast. We are back and we are going to talk about all things health, wellness, body work, massage therapy with our guest Stephanie. Welcome to the show. such a treat, such a treat. I want to start out with your Guinness book of world record achievement. Tell me about that. What happened?

Stephanie Thaler (04:19.554)
Thanks for having me.

Stephanie Thaler (04:29.336)
So during 2020 was COVID and there were lockdowns and so we couldn't go to the gym regularly. And so I just started doing burpees at home. So I was doing about 300 burpees every day. I moved all the furniture out of my living room, my couch, everything. So I would have space to just do burpees. So I started doing 300 burpees every day. And after nine months, I had done 64,000 burpees.

And then I attempted the world record for the first time in March of 2020 and I missed it by six reps. And so then I went on to continue training for a couple more months. And then I finally broke the world record and got 715 burpees in 60 minutes. Wow.

I never do another burpee again, it'll be too soon.

Freddie Kimmel (05:19.406)
If you it's kind of like Forrest Gump, he was just tired of walking. What was the recovery like on the backside of that challenge?

Stephanie Thaler (05:26.476)
You know, because I had been doing so many burpees, like I said, I had amassed sixty-four thousand in the nine months after I had broke the record, it was kind of just another day of training. Every Friday I had been doing six hundred burpees. So to just add another, you know, hundred and fifteen to that wasn't that much of a stretch. Thankfully. Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (05:47.278)
Have you always had a lean in or a slant towards fitness? What got that bug in your pants?

Stephanie Thaler (05:53.442)
So when I was eighteen, I was diagnosed with thyroid cancer and I had grown up a dancer and a gymnast. And so my junior year of high school, I had started gaining weight, which was, you know, I always had this beautiful dancer gymnast body. And I was kinda like, This is, you know, something's not quite right here. But I would go to the doctors and they would say, you know, you're just struggling with depression. You're a teenager, like, here's some packs. They'll give me antidepressants.

And then my senior year of high school, I actually had a tumor start growing out of the front of my neck. It had been growing in before that time. And so I went in and high it had a biopsy. And I ended up having surgery to remove my entire thyroid. And back then, the way they did treatment was they made you wait three months where you weren't medicated with thyroid medication because you had to do radiation. And so I had gained 60 pounds in three months.

Which was devastating for me growing up, you know, still active and fit. And so once I had recovered from my cancer, I just started working out and I became a personal trainer. And that was also during that time that I went to massage school. I was in my freshman year of college when I was going through my treatment, and so I had to drop out the rest of that semester.

until I was well enough to go back. And so I signed up for two weeks of massage school because I realized during my radiation treatment how important touch was, especially when you're not feeling well. So I did iodine 131 radiation, where they lock you up in the corner of a hospital and have you swallow a radioactive pill, and no one could touch me for five days. So I was just isolated in the hospital. Someone would come in in a hazmat suit and dagger count me, and that was my only

interaction with another human during that time. And I just felt terrible. And so I signed up for two weeks of massage school and I loved it so much I ended up staying the whole program and not going back to college. So having cancer helped me find my calling, which is just incredible.

Freddie Kimmel (07:56.17)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I say that personally, I say it's the best thing that ever happened to me, but that doesn't always sit well with everybody. Everybody has a different experience. I get it. Well, I love that you use that moment where you had a little trip in a fall and it redirected your path. Yeah. Yeah. It's wild. You know, I was at an event yesterday. I was helping a clinic set up a flopresso and there was a there was a young girl there who she'd been out of high school for two years and she had spent one year in a wheelchair and she had had

some type of mysterious autoimmune condition. And I just I really she was so sweet. She was so lovely. And I just really felt for her because high school is hard enough. It's hard enough with no physical things. And here's this kid having to navigate this really complex autoimmune issue, which even finding great practitioners, there's not always a clear path through that. So it can be very complicated.

And yeah, I got to tell my story. It was really sweet. It was really sweet. I was like, I know how bad this sucks. And I know how bad you want to be with your friends right now, but I think you're going to get through this and you'll find on the other side it's a it can be a really, a really a tome, like a knowledge bomb that nobody else gets to carry besides you because you've walked through the fire. Yeah. Yeah. It was really just my heart was with her.

Stephanie Thaler (09:22.688)
Yeah, and hopefully she can use that experience to help others too when she's on the other side of it.

Freddie Kimmel (09:27.47)
That's right. That's right. That's right. It's wild. You know, it's so funny. I've been saying to people, and I followed, I saw your account and I was like, wow, she looks like she's really good. I've had thousands of hours of body work because of all the things, of all the scar tissue and all the stuff. I mean, a lot of it. And and I will tell you this I have two branches of like there's like the feel good, relax my body massage.

And then there's like the medical stuff I've done. And that'd be the long term or long extended holds, like the Burrell Institute work on internal abdominal adhesions and like pelvic floor flora, which is like literally like prostate work. That was life saving to me. Like it did some of the things that I achieved there as far as like adhesion relief from all the abdominal stuff. It did what surgery could not do.

And it was very fringe. Like I was like going down to these clinics in southern Florida, and there was like one type of practitioner, or I was like flying out to see this woman in California. Wild, very fringe, and it was like transformational work. Yeah. And then there's this other part of me where like as I've evolved in my being and like understanding of like the nervous system, there are very few people that I can get a massage from because

Stephanie Thaler (10:38.19)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (10:53.098)
I feel when people are forcing as opposed to listening what my tissue is giving. And it's like, yeah, it's just been harder and harder to find a good person. Like, how do you view the body and like the tension index and the mind's ability to like create, or let me say this like mechanical like patterns or adaptive patterns to create tension in the body? Like, what are your thoughts on tissue in the body and mechanics?

Stephanie Thaler (11:22.422)
Well, I always say that healing is 98% intention and 2% technique. So as a practitioner, if you really want to help someone, you will. I mean, there's a million different ways to skin a cat, right? And like you said, you've gone and seen all these people and they've done different things for you and you had different needs. So it's just meeting someone where they're at and making them feel comfortable. And I feel like clients can feel what your intention is.

And I think that's one of the most important things when working with people is that if you're setting this intention that you really want to help them, people can feel that. And then that's gonna allow their nervous system to relax into it. It's gonna allow their body to trust what you're doing. And then having knowledge around what you're doing and accurately communicating that to the client.

Like, you know, this might be uncomfortable, but this is what the result is going to be. And if you're uncomfortable at any time, please communicate that to me and then we'll draw back and go forward again in baby steps. And so I feel like just really paying attention to your client's body and where they're holding tension, it's huge as far as being able to get good results for people. And a lot of

What I find in people, even though it's showing up physically, is so much emotional, you know, trauma that's trapped in bodies. That's mostly what I'm working with. And, you know, I work with a lot of professional athletes. And so they're very like hardcore. And, you know, I want everything hard and everything has to hurt in order for it to be effective. And so just taking, you know, the time to educate your clients about not everything has to hurt.

And a lot of times, you know, I'll have these big two hundred pound athletes on my table and they'll just start crying when I'm working on them. And for guys, it can be kind of uncomfortable, but just holding space for people and allowing them to release that trauma just does wonders for the physical body and healing too. So I hope that answers what you

Freddie Kimmel (13:29.978)
yeah. Well yeah, just yeah, it gets me in the rabbit hole. We'll keep going. When you you started out in massage school, how has your understanding of of the body and training evolved? Like have there been pivotal teachers and mentors which have changed the way you think about tissue?

Stephanie Thaler (13:46.574)
So I was very blessed in my original massage training. I had an amazing instructor who was doing structural integration. and he ended up being my deep tissue teacher. He wasn't supposed to be the person was on maternity leave that typically taught that class. And so our class was very fortunate to be able to have him as an instructor.

And he was very confident and competent in what he was doing. And so he made us very competent and confident when we left school and went off into the world. But I've always been looking for the next best thing technique-wise to help my clients. So I'm constantly taking some kind of training. I'm an instructor myself, but I still I'm always trying to learn.

It makes it fun to have new skills when you go back into the office. And after 28 years, you have to find ways to keep it fresh and exciting. And so I mean, I'm just like I said, I'm constantly doing continuing education. Most of what I've looked for with learning is, I mean, obviously deep tissue, sports massage, kind of harder, tougher techniques versus like the soft energy work or the somatic work.

But yeah, so a year ago I started this adhesion release training. And that has just been absolutely transformational for my business. I've always had a pretty busy practice, but actually being able to go in and treat the nervous system and release adhesions around nerves that are causing people long term chronic pain, sometimes for decades, has just been absolutely amazing for the results for my clients and for my business.

Freddie Kimmel (15:29.294)
Talk me about adhesion. So like how would you describe that for the listener at home?

Stephanie Thaler (15:34.476)
Yeah. So either from overuse, injury, or weakness, our body gets to a place where it doesn't have the capacity to handle the load that we're trying to put on it. And so to compensate for that, the body will lay down collagen to try to strengthen or hold the area and give it more capacity that it needs to be able to do whatever it is that we're trying to do. And so that collagen forms these adhesions.

And sometimes in that adhesion, the nerves can get entrapped. And so a lot of techniques just focus on adhesions of the muscle tissue, which can be effective. But when the nerves are entrapped in there, I mean, we have seven trillion nerves in the human body. And when they get entrapped, like I said, it can cause some major problems for people. And so adhesion release methods specifically is working and targeting those nerve adhesions.

So we go in, we put people through a range of motion testing. That lets us know which nerves are involved that we're going to be working with. Then we will manually go in and release those adhesions. So myself as a practitioner, I'll go in, find the adhesion on the nerve. And then I have an assistant or I have my client put themselves through a range of motion. And in doing so, we're actually ripping the adhesion right off of the nerve.

And the results are immediate and it's incredible.

Freddie Kimmel (17:01.76)
So cool. Yeah. So cool. I have somebody I need to fly up and see you. They're having this like shooting pain down their lower backs, sciatica, but all the scans have like, No, there's nothing wrong, nothing wrong. And yeah, his wife is like, There is a nerve entrapped. It's like watch, you know, and he's like doing the wincing. It's very hard for him to just be.

Stephanie Thaler (17:07.126)
Would love to have

Stephanie Thaler (17:23.936)
Yeah, it's terrible. I mean, you just lose your quality of life. You just can't be yourself. I mean, it's a it's a really devastating way to try to live. And I have all these people who come to me who have seen all the experts. They've been to the May Clinic. You know, I'm here in Minnesota and Mayo Clinic's a big healthcare facility here. And all these doctors will be like, No, you know, your MRIs aren't showing anything, you're fine. And eventually they kind of end up gaslighting people into thinking that they're crazy.

And there's like you know, there's no reason that you should have this pain. And so people come to me kind of as their last hope. And so it can be a lot of pressure, but it's also really fun when we do get results for them.

Freddie Kimmel (18:03.926)
Yeah, high stakes, high rewards.

Stephanie Thaler (18:06.126)
Yeah, exactly. No pressure.

Freddie Kimmel (18:08.526)
I love it. And how many sessions can it take to resolve a nerve that's locked up in an adhesion or something that's been there for 10, 15, 20 years?

Stephanie Thaler (18:22.63)
Right. So something that's more chronic will typically take more sessions to resolve, but I typically tell people in their first appointment to expect between four to six sessions every two weeks just so that we can build off what we've been doing in the previous sessions. And then depending where people are at on session six, then we'll kind of go from there. I think the most I've ever had to do is 16 sessions with someone. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (18:48.694)
Yeah. Yeah. And tell me if you're comfortable, I'm let me say this. We're releasing this podcast. This will be in twenty twenty six. Give me a price range for people. Like what would you say? Do you do like 10 packs? Is it per session cost? Is it by the hour?

Stephanie Thaler (19:04.664)
So I personally just do per session and I charge a hundred and sixty dollars for twenty-five minutes. My mentor out in New Jersey, he does fifteen minute sessions for three hundred and fifty dollars. Wow. Yeah, he's absolutely incredible. he basically created this technique. And so all of us practitioners from around the world, there are only fifty of us worldwide who are licensed in adhesion release methods.

And so we'll all go to New Jersey for training four to six times a year. But he is he's the master. He has people flying from all over the world to be treated by him.

Freddie Kimmel (19:41.014)
Yeah. I mean, it's the time and quality of life. It's like I know people sometimes hear about a therapy. I mean, I did this. I went to a week long, it was 20 hours, it was $7,000 to do internal abdominal medical massage. But I was 20 hours in in five days. It was pretty, it was very, very intense. Yeah, it was crazy. But I remember seeing the pri I was like, I can't, you know, I can't afford that. But I was also like, well, I'm every day, every breath, I'm in.

Stephanie Thaler (20:00.801)
Intensive, yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (20:11.214)
terrible pain and I can't go to the bathroom. So there was like there was a piece of that was like, I don't, I'm gonna come up with the money. I don't care. But I know we can look at these and see a price tag. And for me, on the other side of it, I was like, my God, if someone had told me that you could fix my problem, all the money that I've spent on toys and gadgets and supplements and like empty promises, shit, like let's go. Tell me what the amount is. Like just give me out of pain. And I feel like

If you can deliver the experience and the results, you can charge what you're gonna charge. I think that's right.

Stephanie Thaler (20:45.92)
Yeah. I'm actually the highest paid manual body worker in my state right now since I've learned this technique. And we have a prerequisite for our clients that you have had to be in this chronic pain for at least six months and seen at least three other practitioners or providers before you come to see us. So we're not just taking somebody that woke up with neck stiffness. We're only seeing people who have been in pain for a long time.

Freddie Kimmel (21:11.586)
Yeah. That's amazing. Now let me ask you this. How do you manage your body as a body worker and somebody who is putting all this energy into this other tissue? Because I know there's a great toll and strain on manual therapists. In fact, because of the industry I'm in, most people are coming to me and they're like, What can I bring into my clinic that can help and save my timeline that I'll be able to do this for the next, you know, twenty years because I'm toast.

Stephanie Thaler (21:41.896)
Right. So the average lifespan of massage therapist career-wise is three to seven years. Yep. And I've been doing this for twenty-eight years. And I credit a lot of that to first of all growing up a dancer and a gymnast. So having a very strong back and core to begin with. And then I do Pilates at least once a week, non-negotiable Pilates I recommend it to everyone. It's a game changer. It's life-saving. Having a strong core is key to everything.

And then I trained my husband how to massage me six years ago. I was having some chronic neck and hand pain from 22 years of traditional massage. And so I taught him how to work on me. And so now we have a standing date night every Wednesday for the last four years where he gives me a two-hour massage. And so that has been amazing for my longevity. it's amazing for our relationship. He really likes to do it. And so

I think it's the key to a happy marriage. Like I don't care if my husband leaves his socks on the floor because I know I'm getting that massage on Wednesday night. So yeah. So now my husband's actually in massage school also. And so he's gonna join my practice this fall, just because I'm so busy and he loves it so much. And so it's been great to be able to share that together.

Freddie Kimmel (22:48.686)
Good. That's a great idea.

Freddie Kimmel (23:06.882)
That's great. Do you guys have a studio or you work out of the home?

Stephanie Thaler (23:09.73)
Yeah, so I have a studio in Minneapolis and a part of town called Linden Hills. So I work with thirty-three NHL players and most of them live on that side of town. So it's about twenty minutes away from where my house is. But yeah, I've been there for I've been in that area for about ten years now and I love it.

Freddie Kimmel (23:29.592)
So fun. So fun. I love I love working with high end athletes. I got to work with the Kansas a guy in the Kansas City Chiefs last year and then a guy on the Miami Dolphins. All lymphatic drainage stuff. Yeah, it's yeah, it's so fun. So fun. Such a dip

Stephanie Thaler (23:44.894)
Because they're so into taking care of their bodies 'cause that's their business, right? It's like yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They're very compliant.

Freddie Kimmel (23:49.878)
Only thing that matters.

Freddie Kimmel (23:54.848)
Yeah, is I think we all should be. It's so funny. I'm editing this clip from a show that that's out now and the Elaine is a she's a firecracker from MagnaWave, PMF and she she's like, you know, I think it's ridiculous that these young girls they'll like Botox themselves, you know, from nineteen years old on and that's considered maintenance, but they won't maintain the inside of their internal cellular function. It's a really harsh clip, but I like, Well, it's it's pretty true.

Yeah. It is true. So I think it's a priority. It's like what we prioritize. I mean, you look at that look at a house, look at a porch when you drive down the road. I'm always like, how many Amazon boxes are on that porch? Like, what are we buying? What are we investing in? How many cars sit in the driveway? You know, it's so silly. But there is no that's the other hardship to learn for me as an adult that health insurance didn't mean health care. That like that is a separate cost.

And no matter how much you complain or throw your hands up about the broken system, it ain't gonna help you. Like I had to be like, okay, I'm I'm allocating these funds every year out of po this is just what it is. And to get high level care that was really moving the needle and reversing disease, then that's a different it's a different conversation.

Stephanie Thaler (25:16.622)
Yeah, I mean, my first initial, you know, block of sessions is about $900 total. And that can be a giant investment for people. And I've had people come into the office and say, Well, you know, I'm not a professional athlete making $7 million a year. How am I supposed to afford this? And I say to them, you know, I have school teachers, I have computer programmers, I have mental health therapists who are all investing this money.

Because they see it, you know, as an investment in their quality of life and their long term health. And so it you don't have to be a millionaire to be able to take care of yourself. You just have to prioritize it.

Freddie Kimmel (25:55.36)
Yeah, it's a totally. It's choices, right? Yeah. It's just a choice. And it's it doesn't have to be for for everybody. I think that the other thing that I see on the other side is like the better I feel, the better my word recall and mental clarity is as I'm, you know, dosing myself up with like fractionated special water over here. So my protein is refolding. Yeah, all the bullshit. But like I'm doing this because on the other side of that, my functionality.

allows me to show up in a way where I do I generate way more income. It's I'm more capable. So it's like, what doors are you opening through the absence of pain? Through like elite fun just the idea to listen to like five people, hear all the concepts and see it through a specific lens. And I'm like, we need to do that. And then that works and it keeps working. They're like, ask Freddy what he thinks we should do here. Just by having a unique lens, right? Yeah.

Stephanie Thaler (26:51.916)
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (26:53.878)
I just I I health is wealth. It's so important.

Stephanie Thaler (26:57.646)
It's everything. Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (27:00.406)
Yeah. What type of technologies you alluded to this a little bit. What what type of things do you use to complement your work as as a body worker for tissues and adhesion and better performance?

Stephanie Thaler (27:13.816)
So in the office, with every session that I do, I'm using shockwave. and so shockwave technology uses a radio frequency and it goes into the tissues and it breaks up scar tissue. And then it also brings in regenerative new blood flow to the area for healing. It's been an absolute game changer for my clients' results. we're able to get into places like the abdomen really deep, you know, post surgery C sections.

Pernious surgeries. A lot of my NHL players end up having abdominal surgeries. and so we're able to use that shockwave technology to really get in there in the places where my fingers might not be able to reach. And so that's been a game changer. We also have a Hugo P EMF machine. We have the in the professional level. it was about a $17,000 investment, but it's absolutely incredible. It's FDA approved for

Healing fractures and bones. And so a lot of my hockey players will end up with fractures and we can heal them in a third of the time. It's FDA approved to help with depression and anxiety. So a lot of my hockey players are coming in with concussions. and the symptoms from that can include, you know, depressive symptoms. And so being able to use the coils on their head is huge.

and then a lot of people, if they've just had an injury and we can't manually work on them, to be able to use the non-invasive PEMF is huge. just to jump start their healing as well. Great. And then we also have red light therapy. My husband and I have eight JUVE panels at home. We have basically a whole wall of them. Yeah. So we always do our research before we invest in these technologies. And so we try it on ourselves first as the guinea pigs, and then we introduce the technology at the office to the clients.

Freddie Kimmel (29:01.868)
That's great. That's great. We're just I'm part of a company called Light Path LED and we're launching one called the Titan, which is I think it's six foot by three and a half foot. It's just one. wow. And then it's on an it's on an arm and so it's gonna articulate up and down. But the thing I always hear from clinic owners is like they want a red light bed and the beds are beautiful, but they're anywhere I mean they can be forty to eighty to a hundred and fifty thousand dollars. So we're launching this for like forty nine hundred bucks. No, to really

Stephanie Thaler (29:31.342)
Amazing.

Freddie Kimmel (29:32.202)
I know, I'm really excited. It's really strong, the irradiance, you know, all the pulse rates, all the frequencies, all the things, just to provide a an option. And that's like a I have a red light wall. I have a wall and I do my emails in front of it every morning and I like do my breath work, Nance Nick in front of the thing. And I will tell you this when people are always asking me, like, what's it do? What's it do? What's it do? If I were going to my esthetician and do a really high end scan of like skin damage, I don't wear any product. I don't wear sunscreen.

I'm just mindful of when I'm out in the high sun. I have very little skin damage. And I would tell you that this is something I've done since 2019, pretty much five to six days a week for just 10 to 15 minutes, just because again, it's in my workstation, it's part of my workflow. I would tell you I'm aging good for a 48-year-old.

That it's just something that's slowing, because we're all gonna still age. It doesn't make you not get old, but I do think it improves like collagen. I think it helps with joint pain. I think it helps with just the glow that you would entertain. As you know, there's other things there like mitochondrial function and release of nitric oxide and like increase of cytochrome C oxidase enzyme within the cell, which is mitochondrial function, all the things. But

I do think it's a nice little insurance policy, albeit I think it's sometimes over marketed as like red light is the solution to your pain, which I've not found to be true.

Stephanie Thaler (31:03.842)
Yeah. It's definitely g a good complementary treatment, but I wouldn't use that as a first line for chronic pain.

Freddie Kimmel (31:10.978)
I wouldn't either. I wouldn't either. However, again, going back to that thing that health is wealth, when you look good and you're glowing, there is a move I find this is how I describe it, there is a lean in. When you're talking about health and you're doing it, personally, like if I walk up to somebody and they're like selling a red light bed and they're like 60 pounds of visceral belly fat and they got black circles under their eyes, I'm like, Well, why is it not working for you? What's it not why is it not working for you?

Like tie it together for me, right? I do think there's that glow that comes that that's really nice with red light.

Stephanie Thaler (31:46.294)
Yeah. And I feel like because I'm fit and I do all of the things, that is another key to my success, is working with professional athletes and, you know, multimillionaire executives is like I walk my talk, you know, and people really appreciate that. And then I educate them about all the things that I'm doing because they're like, Well, I want to look like you, or you know, I want to have 11% body fat too. What are you doing?

And so that's just like another level of value that I offer my clients too. But just like, you know, walking the talk, you know, doing the homework that you're giving your clients, all of that, people just are gonna take you so much more seriously if you're, you know, a fit and healthy practitioner.

Freddie Kimmel (32:28.46)
Yeah, a hundred percent. I'm curious to ask now I just before we go on, radial versed focused shockwave. Are you familiar with the difference?

Stephanie Thaler (32:40.012)
Yeah. So my machine actually offers both. So we use a different head based on what we're treating. So, like, say we're using the smaller head to treat the greater occipital nerve in the skull, you're not gonna do radio there, you're gonna do more focused, right? Because you're not like trying to fry someone's brain. You're trying to get very specifically focused on that greater occipital nerve. Where when I'm working in the stuff stomach with like a psoas adhesion or a iliacus adhesion.

then we want that more broad frequency to be able to cover a larger area and get deeper. So that's kind of the difference between the two.

Freddie Kimmel (33:18.784)
Yeah, I love that. Can I ask what brand you guys use?

Stephanie Thaler (33:22.936)
So I use a Stores Pulse machine as Stores Pulse One. S T O R Z and then P U L S and then number one.

Freddie Kimmel (33:27.63)
How do you spell that?

Freddie Kimmel (33:35.724)
I know that machine. I know stories. Sometimes phonetically I gotta write it out. I could see that in the submachine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it. I love it. I'm always interested in what people are doing and the the focus. I have a so you've got actually two guns on the machine. There's like, are there two attachments? Great. Yeah, that's really smart because I find that sometimes the like the I have one that has like a it's a bullet. There's like a bullet in there and it's like it's generating that like visceral.

Now I find with that one I can't get any I'd love to do my traps, but if I get up here with that gun, the ringing in my ears is like a day and a half. It's just too much.

Stephanie Thaler (34:16.949)
Yeah, you should check. They should have a plastic tip head that you're able to switch out for that and specifically use it on the cervical area.

Freddie Kimmel (34:25.621)
Yeah. I think it does. I think I've never opened that attachment head.

Stephanie Thaler (34:30.604)
You definitely should 'cause nobody wants tinnitus for forty eight hours after treatment. And it's such it's so effective in the cervical area and the traps too. Like that final accessory nerve lives right where the neck and the traps meet. And it's such a bugger to get to. But if you can shockwave that, it is it's incredible the results that you'll get and like the long lasting effects too.

Freddie Kimmel (34:52.842)
Yeah. That'd be a good partner one too. Be like, babe, I'm laying down on the table, like just shockwave my whole body.

Stephanie Thaler (34:58.83)
Yeah, my husband and I have Shockwave Sundays, so we bring the machine home every Sunday and we use it on each other.

Freddie Kimmel (35:05.646)
Yeah. I did a a course last year. I did CFT Global. So it's craniocral fascial therapy. It's a three-day training with Kim and Holly. And we go through it's very much craniocral, but also like the muscles and the mouth and the face and breathing pathways. And you're feeling for that wave of the cerebral spinal fluid, which is really interesting. Once you start to feel it, you're like, whoa, that's different than my pulse. And I'll do that on her. And she like melts. She

Always fall, she's like toast, falls asleep on the table. in fact, she just had surgery last week. She had a terrible headache because they she had fibroid surgery and they, you know, they fill your belly up with CO2 when you're doing robotic surgery. And so the referred pain is terrible. And the meds were not touching it. And I was like, get on the table, headache free in like 30 minutes, and she passed out for like six hours. Yeah. Such a good technique.

Stephanie Thaler (36:00.246)
I love it.

Yeah, way better than Perkassat. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (36:05.694)
Way better. She does not handle drugs well, post surgical drugs. I'm like, babe, you should not do this.

Stephanie Thaler (36:13.919)
Ha ha.

Freddie Kimmel (36:15.182)
So we covered body care. We covered self care. So you guys have a a a time where you trade off. Obviously you use the shockwave and the P E F and the red light on yourself. You said you you also s you I think maybe before we hit record, you said you have contrast therapy at home.

Stephanie Thaler (36:32.738)
Yeah, so we have a wood fired sauna from Voyager. And so we like to get that puppy up to about two twenty. So we like it real hot. and then we have a horse trough for our cold plunge right outside of that. And then we also have a plunge brand cold plunge up in our gym. Love it. And then we we also have a ozone sauna in our gym. So we have the ozone generator and then you can hook that up to the sauna and that just helps the ozone get into the tissues even deeper. Yep.

Freddie Kimmel (36:49.388)
great.

Stephanie Thaler (37:01.304)
So those are the main self care tools that we like to have at home for biohacking.

Freddie Kimmel (37:06.37)
And that's like self care, that's at home, that's not part of your business model.

Stephanie Thaler (37:09.782)
Right. I would love to have it at the office, but there's just off it's really hard to get space in Minneapolis, so

Freddie Kimmel (37:16.618)
Is it? That's so interesting. You guys should build something.

Stephanie Thaler (37:19.566)
I would love to. A barn. Yeah, right. I see just putting up sheds

Freddie Kimmel (37:28.042)
I always say I want a wellness barn. I've I had a vision board years ago. I drew like a barn, you the barniniums that people build. I think that would be a killer business. And then if you had all the my new idea, I'm just giving this to the internet because we should all do it, is if you built one of those and you had individual treatment rooms where people could do their one-offs, but the central space everybody had access. So not everybody had to go by.

Stephanie Thaler (37:35.703)
Yeah, they're beautiful.

It would.

Freddie Kimmel (37:58.028)
you know, floppressos and shockwaves and red light walls. If there was just a communal space and then everybody had access to those as a practitioner, that would be a killer business model. Also you get the the community feel, which like half the fun of like going to a really good place is seeing your your friends and buddies doing this stuff together.

Stephanie Thaler (38:15.637)
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (38:18.06)
I'm gonna build it out. I'm gonna design it. It's in the plan. What do you see in your business model for the future? Do you have like a vision board or a direction you see yourself going?

Stephanie Thaler (38:19.618)
Yeah.

Stephanie Thaler (38:30.06)
Well, I just raised my rates again. So I'm up to $320 for 50 minutes of adhesion release. So, like I said, I'm the highest paid manual therapist in my state. I don't really want to raise my prices much more than that because I don't want to lose my everyday clients. I don't want to just only offer my treatment to, you know, multimillionaire athletes and professionals. And so

I have been doing all this continuing education. I think I'm gonna take about a year off from doing any classes. and I wanna write my own classes about working with professional athletes where I take all of the knowledge from all of the different continuing educations that I've taken over the last twenty-eight years and put that into classes that people can use specifically for working with professional athletes. I've been the massage therapist for the Minnesota Vikings, so I worked with NFL players.

I was the 2022 Olympic women's hockey team therapist for their residency. I've worked with major league baseball players. And so I've worked with all these different kinds of professional athletes. And there aren't a lot of classes out there that specifically teach techniques just for working with athletes. And so I want to spend some time writing those classes out over the next year. like I said, my husband's in massage school right now, so I'll be bringing him on to help me.

I opened the first barefoot massage school in Minnesota two years ago. So five years ago when my hand and my neck were killing me so much from traditional massage after 22 years. I flew out to Chicago and I took a class in barefoot massage. And the first day I was there, I was like, I have been doing massage wrong this whole time. Using your feet and body weight and gravity to be able to get into those tissues is just absolutely incredible, life-changing for both the therapists and the clients.

And so I teach five barefoot massage modality classes right now at my training center in Minnesota. So I would like to write a few more classes for that. So kind of getting more into teaching and mentoring versus just being in the office for, you know, nine, 10 hours a day. Sometimes I'm seeing up to 15 clients in a day, which is a lot. you have to really love it to be able to handle that kind of caseload day after day.

Stephanie Thaler (40:50.338)
But I know that I am a human being and not a robot. And at some point I'm not gonna be able to use my body like this forever. And like we talked about, you know, you have practitioners reaching out to you saying, Hey, what are some other options that I have for treating my clients where it's not so physically taxing for me? And so eventually I would like to be able to add things like a float tank.

I think like mindfulness is something that's really missing in recovery, especially with professional athletes. I know a lot of them are doing breath work now, but I would like to be able to add a float tank and just, you know, look into I'm always researching with the biohacking piece to figure out what next best technology I want to add to my practice as well. But I want to be able to do this as long as I can because I absolutely love it and I can't imagine not doing it.

Freddie Kimmel (41:39.082)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, get you down to three hours a day or something and just start teaching the next gen and make sure that there is a you've built a U to like run your center so people can continue to get that care.

Stephanie Thaler (41:50.53)
Right.

The hard part with training people is not a lot of people want to work hard. I found that with mentoring is like you

Freddie Kimmel (42:01.292)
Say that for the back of the room, Seveny.

Stephanie Thaler (42:04.534)
Really love it and you have to really want it and like you can't be there for the wrong reasons. Like I really want to help people. Like I myself, I have struggled with depression and anxiety for a really long time. I do ketamine therapy now for the last four years and have gotten my depression into remission, which is a big part of why I've been able to have the success with my business that I've had, especially in the last couple of years.

But like I really wanna help people because I understand what it's like to be in pain and to try all these different things and to not have results from it and to feel hopeless. And so when people come into my office and they have treatment for the first time and they just have tears because they finally feel hope, like that's my driving force every day. That's what keeps me going, you know, for nine hours a day in the office. But there just aren't a lot of people who wanna do the work. And so that is

Kind of the hard part of scaling is finding those people who are really in it for the right reasons. You can't do this job to try to make money. You know, I have people come to me and they're like, well, you're making $320 an hour. I'm just coming out of massage school. If I train with you, I should be able to do that too, right? And it's like, well, it took me 28 years to get here. Yeah. You know, touching people is a skill and the palpation and to be able to tell the difference of what.

different tissues are and what's hypertonicity and what's an adhesion. And so that takes a lot of time and patience and it just takes reps. And I found that a lot of people aren't willing to have the patience to stick with it and put the time in that's required to be excellent.

Freddie Kimmel (43:43.736)
I feel that on such a deep level. Yeah. I really do. I really do. It is a quick reward society we've generated. The invention of the iPhone, really. Like quick information, quick dopamine hit. It's real I see this all the time. Yeah. People ask me, they're like, What do I do to launch the podcast? And how do I make a hit podcast? And how do I generate money? I'm like, my God. It was like it's sort of a wash, right? I mean

Yeah. You know, it pays for itself, but it's sort of a wash. My first piece of advice was like, Look, the only reason why I'll probably never stop is because I get to have conversations with people like you, which we wouldn't get to do this. You're a stranger, essentially. We met on the internet. But I get to be as curious as I wanna be. And I always learn something profound from it, whatever it is. And after seven and a half years in the world of wellness, I would challenge most people. I was like,

As a consultant, I'm like, I'm pretty versed. Like, I go to trainings every year, but I every single week I'm talking to a new doctor, a practitioner, people that have stage four cancer, the highest level clinicians in the world. And I'm like, you know, where does the information and the training and the study, where does that fall apart in clinical practice? And that's like, that's the value of the podcast. You just get to keep learning through this awesome filter. But is it like,

It's not even a point zero zero one percent of people that make a living off podcasting. Not that it doesn't happen, but I don't think that's why you should do it.

Stephanie Thaler (45:20.844)
Right. Do what you love and you'll never work a day in your life, right? Like you just gotta be passionate about it and then success will come.

Freddie Kimmel (45:27.682)
That's right. That's right. I know. I said somebody said this to me. I went out to a friend. We went out to dinner with a new friend. He's a firefighter. He's like, you know, he's like came over and he's like looks at all the tech and we got like the, you know, the community sauna and all the, you know, he's like, dude, he's like, You got my dream job. He's like, all I wanna do is like talk about wellness. It's like, I love it. I love it. I love it. I was like, and I was like, I do. I was like, it's really

Yeah, from a Broadway performer going to like get I get to work in the world of wellness, which is what I always loved and I was so passionate about. It's such a blessing. But it ain't overnight.

Stephanie Thaler (46:02.836)
No. No.

Freddie Kimmel (46:04.238)
And the heartache that goes along, you know, the heartache, I'm like, nobody's paid me a paycheck in nine years. Like, if I don't do the work, nobody's gonna be like, here's your rent this month. I'm like, no, it's like every day's a hustle. So not not every nervous system is built for built for that.

Stephanie Thaler (46:26.636)
Yeah. True story.

Freddie Kimmel (46:28.59)
Yeah, you know. Yeah. Yeah. It's really, it's really, really interesting. What is your advice to people that are getting into the field, business owners that want to make and you're doing a lot of different things, but maybe want to make their way in a role of service, that they want to have a business that impacts people's health. Like what are some pieces of advice you'd offer?

Stephanie Thaler (46:49.644)
Well, like I said, you have to show up and be present. You have to be doing it for the right reasons. Get really good mentors. Find people who are excellent at what you're trying to do and use their knowledge and experience to your advantage. Always be curious. Always be learning. Don't be stagnant. Don't think that you know everything. And that will really

take you a long way into places that you never even expected. I think curiosity is huge if you want to be successful in this career. And be humble. Don't think you, like I said, don't think you know everything because you don't. There's always something else to learn. And that's one of the exciting things about health and wellness, right? Is there's like a million different techniques out there that you can learn. And so just find your niche.

Figure out what it is that you want to offer, who you're offering it to, and then go get mentors that will help you create what you're trying to be successful at.

Freddie Kimmel (47:50.762)
Yeah. Amen. Amen. I love that. I love that. Well, let us if we're at the top of the hour. We can close this one down for now. All right. I will ask you because it's the beautifully broken podcast, what does it mean to you to be beautifully broken?

Stephanie Thaler (48:06.774)
I think just like, you know, going through my depression journey and it's something that I'm never gonna be able to cure, but to be able to keep it in a place where I'm able to function at my highest level every day and just showing up even on the days when I don't feel like it. You know, going into the office every day and being of service just like heals me in ways that I can't even put into words. You know, when you're not doing great.

being of service to other people is one of the best things that you can do for yourself and for others. And so I think that, you know, we're all broken and we're all trying to just get through this crazy life and this crazy world together and doing our best to be of service and show up at our best at what capacity we have at the moment is the best that we can do.

Freddie Kimmel (48:57.59)
Yeah. Incredible. Tell me what your experience has been with ketamine and how did it change your experience of depression?

Stephanie Thaler (49:08.682)
my gosh. So I had tried everything. My dad committed suicide when I was five. and I basically lived in this anxiety fight or flight state for 38 years. I just never felt safe after that. And so I had tried, you know, seek cognitive behavioral therapy. I tried every SSRI, I tried, you know, hypnosis, I tried all these different things. And sometimes it would work for a little bit, and sometimes it actually made it worse. And so I

would have especially have depression and anxiety during the holiday season. So my dad committed suicide on Thanksgiving. And so from Thanksgiving to Christmas is always a really extra hard time of year for me. And so the Christmas of twenty twenty one, I was working with the women's Olympic hockey team and you know, I should have been on top of the world. And I was just really struggling. I had just gone through a divorce and I had a little boy who was I think two or three at the time.

And it just wasn't doing well. And I went to church with some friends of mine and the sermon was about that God is trying to speak to us, but we are so busy and moving so fast that we need to be able to slow down so we can hear him. And that just resonated with me so much. And I just broke down crying and I prayed and I said, God, I cannot live like this for one more day. Like this is just absolute torture to try to white knuckle life with this depression every day.

Like, please send something to be able to help me. And over the next two weeks, podcasts about ketamine therapies just randomly started showing up in my YouTube feed. And so I started doing research on ketamine therapy and I found out that there was a clinic less than a mile from my house. And I saw that it was $500 a session. And I was like, there's no way I'm ever gonna be able to afford this. I called them and my insurance basically covered almost a hundred percent.

And so my first two weeks, I went in for six sessions. And it was the most amazing transformative experience of my entire life. It was so spiritual. Like God showed up in my sessions and he just held me in his hands and he filled me with love and peace and kindness and all of these things that I had been missing my entire life. And my dad came to me, I think, in my second or third session.

Stephanie Thaler (51:34.464)
And he apologized to me for committing suicide and told me that it wasn't my fault that he was just in so much pain that he just couldn't do life anymore. And I had just carried with me like all of this. I'm not, I wasn't enough for my dad to want to stay here and do life with me. And he reassured me that that was not the case at all and that I needed to let go of that. And when I came out of that session, I was literally glowing.

And my husband was like, my gosh, you look like you just saw God. And I was like, I have seen God. Like he held me in his hands. And, you know, my dad came and apologized to me. And in this two weeks of successions, I was able to heal more trauma than, you know, 18 years of cognitive behavioral therapy ever did. And so I did nine months of IV therapy in a clinic. And then I graduated to at home therapy. And now I do at home therapy three to five days a week.

And it's just completely changed my life for the better in every way possible.

Freddie Kimmel (52:34.59)
Amazing. What does IV when you say IV therapy, is that once a week?

Stephanie Thaler (52:39.82)
I started out going three times a week and then I went down to once a week and then they kind of, you know, drop your dose. Like then you go every two weeks, then you go once a month. And so it was helping with my depression, but I still had a lot of anxiety happening in the background. And so that's why I switched to at home therapy on a more regular schedule, because that definitely helps keep my anxiety and my depression at bay better.

Freddie Kimmel (53:03.51)
Yeah. And what does that look like at home? Is that like do you set aside time? Is there like a ritual around that? Is it like a sublingual like a troche or a nasal spray?

Stephanie Thaler (53:13.78)
Yeah. So I actually use a form called a try true trait. So it looks like a little tic tac. Yeah. And I take between three and five of those at a time and I swish them around in my mouth for about thirty minutes. It's about an hour to ninety minute process between when you first take the medication. And then sometimes I'll put on headphones and then I have this robotic heated massaging eye mask that I'll put on. And then I'll have a little trip.

my little trip and then usually my husband's laying right next to me while I'm doing it. He's kind of my trip sitter. Just makes me feel safer to have him there. And then I come out of it and then it I just have some time to process. And it's amazing what comes up. There's no way around but through. Sometimes I'm I have no idea what I'm gonna be working on when I go into the session. And it's just it's profound every single time. Whatever it is that I need to work on, my subconscious brings it right there.

And you're facing it and you have to deal with it and then you're immediately better. It's just it's absolutely incredible.

Freddie Kimmel (54:13.238)
Yeah. It's really interesting. First of all, I have to ask you before it slips out of my head, did you watch the series Ted Lasso? Were you a mess when when you revealed I don't want to spoil it for anybody, when he revealed his like secret to the therapist or no? Did it not hit you?

Stephanie Thaler (54:20.247)
Yes.

Stephanie Thaler (54:29.846)
You know, I don't remember. Yeah. I don't remember what a secret was.

Freddie Kimmel (54:31.638)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (54:35.821)
well h that his dad committed suicide.

Stephanie Thaler (54:38.282)
I mean, yeah, whenever I'm, you know, whenever somebody else has that situation, it's tough, it's tough. It affects you for your entire life.

Freddie Kimmel (54:47.244)
The reason why it hit me when you told me that and also when I was watching the show, I'm a huge fan of the dialogue and and Jason Sadakis and the writing and everything and super stoked they're coming out. Yeah, genius. So fills my heart and they're coming out with a season four. I'm super stoked. The reason it hits me in a special way is that I know the pliability of those operating systems that are being formed in that age from like two years old to like seven or eight.

And that is those experiences as a child are it creates your reality. And so yeah, I'm just so grateful that you found a therapy that allowed you, from my understanding, to help rewrite new neural connections and create an operating system that complemented your way of moving through the world.

Stephanie Thaler (55:39.328)
Yeah, I felt safe. I feel safe. And I don't have to live in this fight or flight anymore. And I don't have to not feel worthy. And I don't have to feel like I'm not enough. And it was instant, instant change and long lasting. Yeah. And then have my husband also tells me every day how beautiful and amazing and how proud he is of me. And so having that positive reinforcement is also important when you're doing ketamine therapy. You know, you don't want to

Freddie Kimmel (55:55.169)
Yeah.

Stephanie Thaler (56:08.012)
be taking in too much negativity when you're in those sessions, but just having positive reinforcement and being regular with making the time to do the therapy. I mean, it it does take up a good chunk of my week. But the quality of life that I'm able to have and the success that I've had, I mean, I owe a lot of it to doing the w the hard work.

Freddie Kimmel (56:28.202)
Yeah, I just had a friend post this very vulnerable article about her having a breakthrough with her partner doing MDMA assisted therapy. Huge breakthrough in their relationship. And it was really interesting. There were couple of people that attacked her in the comments that you know, they were like, Why are you shilling a drug? And you know, really harsh comments. And I just want it's I know and I know people will listen and they'll say, well.

When I was growing up in college, ketamine was a street drug. And it was, you know, ecstasy was like the club pill. That's what you did. You know, all these things, but most of these are now medical, they're medical treatments. They're validated. They understand the mechanism of action. And it's all about the container. This isn't something you willy-nilly want to grab and do at home. You want a therapist. You want a clinical setting where you're where you're safe because you are in a

An extremely disassociative state. And so I just want to reiterate that that these things do work. I have so many success stories in my immediate circle of people, both ketamine and MDMA, as that as that evolves, is a I'm not sure where it's at is at its clearance, but I know it's at least in phase three clinical trials. So it's really viable and that there is research around it. And you gotta say, is this a fit for me? Am I comfortable with it?

Stephanie Thaler (57:52.404)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's about set and setting. You know, like you wanna to have the right mindset going into it. You wanna make sure that you're feeling safe. You wanna make sure that you're feeling supported. You wanna make sure that you're, you know, journaling and processing afterwards. You wanna make sure that you're not taking in you're not like watching a serial killer show after you do your ketamine session. No, don't do that. So it's just, you know, it's it's being

responsible while you're using it and using it for the right reasons. And I'm so glad that IBegain just got approved for PTSD for veterans. And two weeks ago I was just part of a study for a research paper about making ketamine therapy illegal for people in Greece. and so this doctor interviewed me and I'm helping the doctors there to be able to offer ketamine therapy to people that need it in Greece.

in medical settings. So it's happy to be a part of that also.

Freddie Kimmel (58:50.19)
Amazing. Amazing. Impressive. Stephanie, where can people find you?

Stephanie Thaler (58:55.576)
So my biggest social media is Stephanie Thaller LMT on Instagram. It's the same name on Facebook. And I also have a YouTube channel, which is GreatRub. So it's G R the number eight R U B B.

Freddie Kimmel (59:11.502)
G-R the number A R U B B. Great. And that's YouTube. I love it. We'll put all those in the show notes. And thank you for being a guest. I'm so beyond glad we did this. And yeah, I never know. Sometimes I reach out and I'll record and it's a bomb. And then I'm like, I can't hear that. This is amazing.

Stephanie Thaler (59:14.35)
Yeah. Yeah.

Stephanie Thaler (59:35.97)
Well, I'm happy to connect with you too. I've been a fan for a long time. And like I told you before we started the interview, I love all your biohacking information. I love that we can come to one channel and find so many great resources. and I look forward to working with you in the future too, as far as the biohacking technology that you're coming out with and making more affordable for everyday consumers. I love

Freddie Kimmel (59:58.166)
That. yeah. We'll do it. We'll to we should we should totally do an event sometimes. I would love to come to teach lymphatic drainage and do l like a lymph focus for the athletes. It's just something they don't I mean, most let's be honest, 99% of people don't even talk about lymphatics. Yeah. But it's a really fun one. Awesome. We'll close it down for now. Thank you so much for being a guest on the Beautifully Broken Podcast. Big love.

Stephanie Thaler (01:00:20.686)
Thanks for your time, Freddie.

Freddie Kimmel (01:00:26.232)
Season 9, year 7, nearly 300 episodes built on one belief that healing doesn't need to pick sides. And neither do I. If this show has added value to your life, please take 30 seconds and leave a five-star review on Apple or Spotify. It is the single biggest way to help people who need to find us. And trust me, they're out there looking. And when you're ready to go deeper, head over to beautifullybroken.world. That's my website.

It's not a wellness store. It's everything I personally use to rebuild my body after nine tumors and chemotherapy. This is the technology, the supplements, the self-quantification tools, curated without an agenda, with significant discounts, and completely free from the marketing noise. You're also gonna find a direct path to work with me one-on-one. And access to the Biological Blueprint Academy, where the real transformational work happens.

No guesswork, no bias, we just give you the full picture. You can also find us on YouTube at Beautifully Broken World for unboxings, product breakdowns, and a face to go with a voice. So, quick note from my vast team of internet lawyers, they are very expensive. Everything here is for education only. Nothing on this podcast is medical advice. Always consult your doctor for your actual medical needs. And as we close, your oncologists

May have saved your life. What comes next is what we do here. We are in a paradigm shift, and the world needs you at your absolute best. Use these conversations as a jumping off point. Listen to your body, trust the process. Life can be painful. But how do we put the pieces back together? That's the beautiful part. I love you, I'm Freddie Kimmel. I will see you in the next podcast episode. Let's go.