Pamela Gold: Biohacking NYC with HACKD Fitness

Pamela has been passionate about mind, body and spirit optimization from a very young age. An overachiever from the start, she grew up on a farm in upstate New York, attended Yale University as a Microbiology and Biochem major, and then moved to NYC where she supported the growth of a restaurant chain from 18 locations to over 100 and was the point person on an IPO, all by the age of 24. After becoming a mom, she became passionate about physical fitness and wellness and founded Fulfill Fitness, specializing in personal training and nutrition coaching. She then spent two years as President of The Beacon Program, a NYC behavioral therapy-based food and weight clinic.

HACKD Fitness represents what Pamela sees as the future of fitness: the convergence of science and tech to give us the next generation of evidence-based evolution.

Pamela is also the best-selling author of Find More Strength: 5 Pillars to Unlock Unlimited Power and Happiness. She lives in NYC with her husband Roger and 2 children, Talia and Jesse.

Episode Highlights

• 1:34 - All about HACKD
• 2:46 - The machine that sets HACKD apart
• 5:32 - It's all about optimization
• 7:52 - One of Pamela's favorite wearable fitness tools
• 12:50 - Unlocking your mind in your fitness
• 16:41 - Will I fit in at this gym?
• 20:19 - How overtraining can speed up the aging process
• 24:25 - Self-care is not indulgent
• 26:06 - Pamela's pain to power story
• 28:47 - Pamela's daily meditation (what it looks like)
• 34:15 - Pamela and Freddie walk down quantum lane
• 39:09 - Science and experience can work together
• 43:43 - Workouts are not the only way to find dopamine hits
• 45:10 - How to keep leveling up
• 49:29 - Getting in touch with HACKD (and a gift for listeners)

Connect with Pamela:

• Check out her fitness studio - https://hackdfitness.com/
• Read her book - https://www.amazon.com/Find-More-Strength-Unlimited-Happiness-ebook/dp/B06XZKTNMN

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (00:00.098)
I'm a big fan of just asking really good questions. Like, how do I know that that is true? And you know, why do I really think that? And like, is this actually empowering me? Because if you're not trying something or not being open to something that has the potential to help you and isn't going to hurt you, what's the harm in trying it? You know, like why would you not, why would you be closed minded to anything that could help you be a better human, live a better life? Why?

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (00:31.395)
Welcome to the Beautifully Broken Podcast brought to you by AmpCoil. I'm your host, Freddie Kimmel, and on this show, we discuss the common thread survivors share after walking through the fire, the practitioners making a difference, and the treatment modalities that deliver healing back into the hands of the people who need it most. Witness the inspiration we gain by navigating the human experience with grace, humility, and a healthy dose of mistakes. Because part of being human is being beautifully broken.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (01:05.391)
All right, team, welcome to the beautifully broken podcast. We are sitting here, a very special treat today on Seventh Avenue in Chelsea in New York City at Hacked Gym. And we are honored to sit down with the owner, Pamela Gold. Hey. Pamela, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for having me. It's such a pleasure. the pleasure is going to be that of this audience. I am so excited.

Pick your brain, why don't you start us off and tell us about Hacked. So Hacked came into being as a result of my real obsession with physical, mental and spiritual strength. And of course it's a gym, it's a fitness center, so we advertise it for the physical strength piece of it. But once you kind of get in and start going down the rabbit hole, physical strength and mental strength and spiritual strength are inherently all connected.

It was a very unexpected path that led me to starting this gym, but it really, just, one of those things it was like being pregnant and the baby was coming. So it was, it was a really fast and furious birth this past, I guess, seven months ago was when we opened. But the main reason it exists is the ARX, which is that big machine over in the corner.

in its mechanical computerized resistance training that actually adapts to us, which allows us to work harder than we've ever really had the capacity to work before in the safest way possible with us in control each moment. So it's pretty, pretty cool. That's incredible. Now, because people can't see the ARX on the podcast,

You know, it looks like a big clunky piece of gym equipment and it's also got a large, I'm gonna say a 26 inch flat screen monitor, which I assume offers a feedback component to the exercise. Yes, each moment of the work is captured. And so you have a graph that shows you all of your output through the full range of motion for each rep. And then it's saved. So set over set, week over week, month over month, you can track all your data.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (03:22.762)
and you're able to just keep leveling up competing with yourself. It's pretty cool. That's amazing. What kind of strength and wellness gains do you see people experience on the ARX? Well, you know, at the end of the day, like everything in life, you get what you give. And so for people that are able to really lean in to kind of that vulnerability and trust and feeling safe and really giving a lot kind of at the highest level of their capacity.

I see people's bodies change so much just in two weeks. The muscle mass that can be built quickly with that machine, it's pretty crazy. I work out less than 40 minutes a week and I keep leveling up in ways that as a 40 year old mom, I didn't really necessarily think would be in the cards at this point in my life. That's incredible.

Yes. That's incredible. I can't wait to try. I'm really excited. You're going to do it, my friend. I'm going to do it. So the idea behind Hacked, you know, can you speak to the mom who has a limited amount of time and you want to get the most result, the most bang for your buck out of your workout? Yeah. So, mean, it's really about efficiency at the end of the day because our time is precious and regardless of where we are in life, you know, that may ebb and flow.

And yes, I am a mom. I've got two bigger ones now at this point, but becoming a parent definitely puts a lot of stress and strain on the amount of time that you have for self care. And so for a parent, that's a certain demographic where efficiency is key. So if you are a mom and you're just struggling to find that little bit of time for yourself, both the ARX and then this bike we have, Carol, give you the most effective minimum dose.

possible of both strength and cardio. And that bike gives us the equivalent of a 45 minute jog in under nine minutes. So it's pretty efficient. So there's really no excuse. You can just kind of squeeze that in any time and you do that three times a week. And studies have shown that's more effective than 150 minutes of like steady state cardio. it's the real deal. Science is pretty cool. Science is beyond cool. And again, know, kind of scrolling my eyes around the space,

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (05:38.099)
For people not here, we've got a vibration plate. We've got a live O2, which is a hypoxic oxygen breathing machine. You're basically on a spin bike hooked up to, I think it's about 100 gallons of oxygen and you're just huffing that pure O2 generated from an oxygen concentrator. What are some of the other toys we've got? So on the recovery side, we've got something called the Nano V.

which uses a specific frequency of light as a bioidentical kind of signal to fake out your body and make your body think that you're getting oxidative stress when you're not. So the cells start responding as if they were under attack, which since you're not under attack, literally reverses the aging process. It reverses DNA damage, oxidative stress, free radical damage. Pretty cool. We've got the FIT3D scan that gives you a 360 degree picture of your body.

and your body composition. use that for good, not evil. Really important for me to point out. It helps us pinpoint any areas where we may be struggling with self love and loving our body because that's an integral part of growing is loving where we currently are. And then it shows us how we can track our results and have an objective measure to see whether all these magical mystical things that I claim work actually do indeed work. We have a sauna, we have the Jove, which is the

photobiomodulation, the near infrared light therapy that on the cellular level increases the amount of ATP we have in our mitochondria and gives you micro-oxidative stress that speeds up the repair and recovery process. Basically everything that we've got here is about optimization. It's like, how can we optimize our fitness? And I try to educate people that, yes, we can increase our fitness level at the detriment of our health level. And so we don't want to do that. We want to be tracking our recovery, which we use

like the, you know, the aura ring or HRV monitor. That's the best way we can tell whether or not we're over training and overstressing our body. So we'd like to take a really holistic approach here and optimize both the workout part, the breakdown of our body, and then the recovery rebuild of the body. And it's all about that efficiency and optimization and health. Yeah. Can you tell the audience at home just a little bit about the aura ring in case they're not familiar? Cause it's pretty cool. Yeah. So the aura ring is one of my favorite.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (08:00.275)
wearable devices. I think they do a really good job crystallizing some important information that we can really use to improve our health. So it tracks your sleep. It tells you how much REM, how much deep sleep you get, how much total sleep you get. It tells you what your resting heart rate is while you sleep and how long it takes to get to its resting level, which is a really important recovery marker as well. It measures the HRV, which is that heart rate variability, which I mentioned before is kind of the best way we have

to figure out how stressed we really are. And a lot of people, it's something that's new to a lot of people. So the HRV, we actually want a high HRV because when we are calm in homeostasis or coherence, there's actually a really big differentiation between kind of the rate that our heart is beating at. When we're stressed, it's much more like a drum. And so we want to see this kind of calm wave, which is the heart rate variability. But that's something that most of us don't even track or know.

And then once you're tracking it, know, knowledge is power, then you can start to tweak what you can do to improve it. It's pretty cool. Yeah. I remember the first time I heard HRV and I, took me a while to grasp why the heart rate, the time between beats would be different when we were in a relaxed state. you think when you just did that, you got the military, the bun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun,

know, waves, there's just this calmness where there is this flow, right? Get trying to get in that flow state when we can really make magic happen. Yeah, you know, it's so cool. And it wasn't until I got in and started talking to your staff. And first of all, for anybody that's going to come to Hacked in New York City, I recommend you get down here. But her staff is so lovely and kind and they're just, you know, they're heart centered individuals.

And a couple people are performers from the Broadway music theater world, which is some of my background. And we started to chat while Pam was doing a restorative treatment. And one thing that came up was the idea that as a performer and a dancer and an artist, our feedback a lot of times is a mirror. And it's that feedback. And I remember so many endless hours in the dance studio, you're looking at your body, you're looking at the lines at your arms making

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (10:20.64)
You're also looking at the shape of your body and you're comparing it to every other person in the room, every hour of the class, because at the end of the day, we're all struggling and vying for this job with there's, there's so few of. Yeah. You've got to stand out and you got to try to figure out that outside in stuff is really, really tricky. And we always again, want to use it for good, right? Like how can we use all of that feedback to help us grow, to help us improve, but not let the toxic pieces of it.

you know, that I'm not good enough or why not me? It's not fair. Any of the victim mentality stuff. How do we not let that in almost like have that semi permeable membrane so we can take the growth, take the opportunity to make us better and rise up, but not let the stuff that weighs us down kind of get in. Yeah, it's, it's, it's so important. And the, ability, the ability to do the diagnostic work on all these machines and these cool toys, it really does take fitness to a new level.

Yeah. And it's, does because you have the actual quantitative data. So you can see objectively. It's not subjective. Like, I felt really good today at the gym. mean, that's great. I hope everybody feels really good at the gym. We all know we have days where we feel better and days when we feel not as good. and it's hard to stay positive. It's hard to stay productive and constructive with a lot of these activities. But when you have real objective measures, it helps really kind of keep us.

on that path, staying motivated, staying accountable and making sure that we're getting the results we hoped that we'd be getting. And I'm like a scientist at heart. So everybody that comes in here, they're like, well, what results am I going to get? I'm like, well, that's an excellent question. I'm like, I'm a scientist. I have hypotheses and we're to do this six week program. And this is what we expect. But obviously nothing is happening in a vacuum. The more information you have at the end of the six week program, we'll be able to see what results we specifically got.

from a strength perspective, from a cardiovascular perspective, and then from a body change perspective. And we can see in black and white how much work we actually did. And so there's a lot more information that we have that you wouldn't have specifically in a different training program. And then that helps you tweak the other factors. So we talk about stress, we talk about sleep, of course we talk about food. But these are all things that, you know, the more information, real information we have,

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (12:41.588)
the more we can start to tweak and get better results, find answers that otherwise would have been hidden in a cloud of just so much unknown. Yeah. No, it really, it really makes your brain spin. So there's a couple avenues that I want to go with this. And one is, so people come in here and they obviously it's not about trying something once it's about giving it a little bit of a run, right? Yeah. Yeah. Well, especially with the ARX because the ARX

allows us to work really, really hard, especially on the eccentric, which is the lowering phase. And we're about three times as strong when we're lowering weight as opposed to when we're lifting it. But most of us have never done eccentric training. So our body, our brain never had to lower that much weight. So we literally have to learn how to do it. Even though our muscles are technically strong enough, that doesn't mean that our brain knows how to make them fire and do it. It also means that we have to figure out how to get that

being uncomfortable because just because your body can lower 2,000 pounds doesn't mean that your mind is going to allow you to do it when it's that scary and uncomfortable. And so it becomes this opportunity, both from a physical standpoint and a mental standpoint for us to learn how to do it. And mental strength is a big piece of that puzzle, but everybody's different in terms of how long it takes for them to learn it. So in the beginning, we want people to try the ARX twice a week so we can learn.

how to do it. Eventually, once you're really operating at that high level and we can tell because the data is all there, like I know what the expected curve is. I know what the expected ratio between the concentric and the eccentric is. I can tell by how kind of smooth the lines are, how the mental strength piece of it is. I don't always tell people that because I don't want them to be self-conscious, but I can tell a lot about someone by their ARX graph, right? So in the beginning, we try to do it twice a week.

But eventually most people only need to do it once a week. And yes, consistency is key, but every six weeks or so we have to deload. You've to take some time off. So it's a natural ebb and flow. And even like I went on a two week vacation two weeks ago now, so I was gone for two weeks. I came back stronger than ever. So it's kind of embracing this process. Yes, consistency, but also this kind of consistent inconsistency. So we keep our body guessing and plateauing. So there's a lot of things that work.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (15:05.123)
But because you have all of the data, you're able to hold yourself accountable and really kind of monitor the results in a way that you don't normally have access to. Yeah, it's this perfect, it's really, it really is a biofeedback loop, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. And it's, it's a really, really powerful, powerful tool. You know, so if, people were going to come in, do you, do you typically recommend that people try a couple months?

of the, of the, of a membership in a gym or do they, is it service by service? Yeah. So what we do when someone comes in, there's like a demo that, you know, is, very reasonably priced so people can come in and try things. But then we recommend a six week program because if you do something for six weeks, we should be able to get a lot of information from those six weeks. No matter what you will get a tremendous amount of results from doing this. Even if you end up not liking it, you're like, Pam, you seem nice, but I really don't like it. No problem. Like you.

you know, but try it, right? And oftentimes too, in the beginning, we have a lot of first impressions and judgments that have to do with fear, right? When you're doing something new. So you make the six week commitment. And then at the end of the six weeks, you're able to assess. And so we really do encourage people to make that six week commitment. And then eventually we do offer memberships. But for me, I mean, this, all the stuff that's in this place is brand new. So for me, it would make sense that you want to like give it a test run. And I think six weeks is a reasonable,

kind of amount of time to really get a sense of whether something feels right, whether you feel good about it, whether you like us and it feels like a place where you feel at home, you know, but then after the six weeks we do offer memberships and offer all of that fun stuff. Yeah. What are some of the varying degrees of levels of health that you see here in the gym? It's one of the things that I'm so proud. I mean, I'm really, really proud and happy that

people in a wide, wide range of fitness levels feel very comfortable here. So we have elite level athletes that come in here that are just, I mean, it's humbling the level of strength and focus and performance that some of our people bring. And it's inspiring, right? And we have people that are extremely obese and struggle with their health on a lot of different levels that come here.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (17:19.787)
and feel cared for here and feel safe here and feel supported here. And the cool thing about all this equipment is it meets you wherever you are. So regardless if you're an elite level athlete or if you're someone that maybe is rehabbing an injury or coming off an illness or just has been kind of chronically unhealthy for a long time, the equipment will meet you right where you are and give you the opportunity to get comfortable, reconnect and level up at whatever pace feels good for you.

It's beautiful. I want to go back to something you said about three minutes ago. You said, you said put down 2000 pounds. Tell me where that that situation exists on one of these machines. So when I do a belt squat, which basically you put a belt around your waist and then there's a cable that's pulling you down the lowering phase. So when it's pulling me down and I'm resisting trying to hold it up, I can lower about 2000 pounds. Wow.

And then I can only press up about 800 pounds. And so that's the differentiation. And because this machine gives you that eccentric capacity, my muscles get that amount of time under tension and that opportunity to have all the micro tears on that eccentric phase. When the muscles are lengthening and working, we get more of those micro tears that build muscle. That's one of the reasons why this machine is so effective at building muscle and building strength. And then of course,

you're going to get really, really tired, really fast. If each moment you're at max capacity, suppose that first rep, I can lower 2000 pounds for like a second or two, and then that drops. And then I can lift like 800 for a second or two, and then that drops. And then that second rep, maybe I can only lower 1600 pounds and so on. And you're so tired, so fast, because literally within like a minute and a half, I'll move 10,000 pounds of weight in a minute and a half.

And it's like, well, of course you're tired. know, your heart's pounding. You're exhausted in way that you've never been exhausted before, but you're the one creating all of the work. So I would never in a million trillion years actually lower 2000 pounds because I would get injured. I could actually be killed. But since I'm the one creating that resistance by working against the computerized mechanical resistance, I'm able to do that work in a safe way. And as I get fatigued,

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (19:43.159)
I'm just doing less work because I'm creating less resistance. It's very backwards from any other kind of strength training. And so it's kind of like, use the same analogy that I use with meditation. When someone asks, what's it like to meditate? It's like, what's it like to when you taste a strawberry has a strawberry taste until you taste the strawberry. If someone tells you it's tart, sweet, a little bit of a pop until you taste that strawberry. It's like really hard to imagine. It's kind of like that with the ARX until you feel it. It's really hard to imagine that you're the one creating.

the resistance and you can stop or pull off, pull back anytime. And that's why it's so safe. Yeah. It's so it's, that's amazing the way you it's, it's hard to wrap your brain around how we've done things in fitness for the last hundred years. You know, it's always been work harder and, push. And one thing from my corner of the ring, you know, being a health coach, I'll often get people

I get a lot of runners that coach and they come in with my runners, often a little bit of adrenal fatigue and you get a little bit of a early joint erosion and joint damage from a myriad of different reasons, whether it's genetics, whether it's the fact that they're running on a road that was made to hold a 2,000 pound car and not dirt, but it is tough on the body. Yeah, well that's the overtraining.

I was a personal trainer for a bunch of years before I went back to work running a company and ended up here eventually. But I used to work out four to six hours a day and I loved it. And I didn't realize at all about HRV or monitoring my recovery. I didn't realize that if I were over training, that I'm actually speeding up the aging process. And you know, when you're in your twenties and you're in your thirties, you can get away with that for a little while.

But as we know, body keeps score. So if you keep over training in any capacity and really varieties of the spice of life, finding kind of the effective minimum dose of whatever forms of exercise, you know, you're trying to use to achieve certain results, right? Like if you think about exercise, it's, it's a decision we're making an activity that we're doing with desired results. So I like to differentiate between

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (22:00.669)
exercise and activity, right? Like you may love to go running. It may not be really an exercise. It may be a fun activity because are you running like hill sprints, time trials, or you just kind of running to enjoy, right? Or, you know, are you running for endurance and is that the best way? Like how often are you supposed to do the long runs? Ideally, do you know what's right for you? Cause everybody's different. And so some people train for a marathon.

and do very, very few long runs. And that's conceivably better as long as their cardiovascular fitness level can sustain that. But research shows that these short, high intensity intervals are what build cardiovascular fitness and endurance more than the longer steady state runs. Or bikes. Yeah, yeah. Do you know what happened with the first guy who ever ran a marathon? I don't. He dropped out at the end.

See, that's heartbreaking, literally. That was heartbreaking for I'm that didn't happen for me when I ran my marathon. I love it. No, I'm always in such admiration of runners because I don't have that gene in my body. Yeah, I I ran a marathon, but that was never my idea of fun. And the only reason I ran it is because I had a friend who basically begged me and kind of guilted me into doing it. And it was too good to resist. It was Paris. And it was definitely a

wonderful experience, but I suffered for months afterwards. And, and it's like, why, why, why would I do that? And okay, again, if short term, you know, that you want to increase your fitness level at the expense of your health and then okay, it's going to take three months to recover. Okay. If that's, if that's what you are signing up for and you know how to do that safely. Okay. But at this point in my life, I'm all about quality of life. And so the choices that I make now for fitness,

have to do with taking this very balanced approach, being as smart as possible and really doing as little as possible to be in peak shape. Because I don't want to overtax my body. I want to stay as young as possible as I age and as healthy as possible. I know, me too. That's a big goal. So you have a big recovery component here in the studio.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (24:15.604)
You know, we've got the nano V we've got the norm attack, compression boots and, and that's such a big part of it. Do you get people coming in from the city that just want to just want to reset? yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's, I think it's definitely the tide is turning where we're starting to realize that recovery or any kind of the self care, right? That's, that's more relaxation focused. It's not being lazy, right? And that's a lot of us have.

that narrative, underlying core belief, whether we're aware of it or not. And just next time notice, do you feel that kind of paying of guilt or not good enoughness that that sometimes happens if you say you're going to take a day off from your exercise routine and take it easy and maybe go get a massage or do Normatec recovery boots or try something new on the restoration side. And you know, does that feel like

you're not doing something right. And a lot of us have all of that kind of built in from when we were young and trying to be overachievers that we always need to be pushing 150 % or, you know, we're not good enough or we're not safe. Someone else is going to beat us to whatever goal it is. You know, there's a lot of that even subconscious just built in that rooted out because that's not a service. But I definitely feel like over the last couple years, there's more,

the studios that are popping up like recover is just up the street. Those guys are awesome. They have a beautiful space where they have a lot of the recovery stuff. You know, there's more people stretch studios. And so I think that there is this awakening around self care and that it's not indulgent, that it's a core part of our health. Yeah, no, I couldn't agree more. I'm a, I'm a big believer in that element. You know, it's, it's one, one thing that comes to mind is I just want to, I want to just pick your brain a little bit.

you know, what was your, what was your pain to power scenario or your turning moment when you realized there was a better way? mean, there's so many, right? Like as human beings were quite dynamic and all the different areas of our life, I have to say my, my biggest kind of as a grownup pain to power story was really in my personal life and being married for about seven years and we were struggling in our marriage. And you know, there were a lot of things that were just,

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (26:38.419)
not healthy. And I knew that I had to focus on my own stuff, right? That I couldn't be blaming others, couldn't be blaming my husband. I had to figure out what was mine, like what was my work to do. And that's when I ended up going to yoga school and starting a meditation practice. But there was a big kind of period of time where there was a lot of just, you know, self-loathing and self-doubt and, just like,

you know, how did I get here and who am I? Like, this is so out of alignment with my values and who I think that I am and want to be. And, you know, to really kind of be in that pain and not blame anyone else for it. Right. And I never really was a blamer. I always at least was at the, know, I'm going to be the hero of my own story level, which luckily there's more levels above that one where it's like not just about me, just, you know, obviously really empowering.

But it was, was that kind of those darkest hours where I really felt like, like I was definitely out of alignment that forced me to start looking at, you know, my, my fear and my pain and my coping mechanisms and meditation became such a huge, huge source of growth and wisdom that ended up unlocking all of this because this hacked only came about not that long ago.

at a time when it was extremely unexpected. had just launched a parenting program. had written a book, launched a parenting program, but it was, was really through meditation that this felt like a calling that I had to answer. And without meditation, I wouldn't have had that access to that kind of deeper source of inspiration and trusting that source of inspiration because literally everybody was like, what are you doing, Pam? Why would you do that? But meditation has been

really kind of the keystone to so much of the last really five years now of just profound growth. It's like a whole different season. I was like a whole different person. Really. And what's your meditation look like on a daily practice? Yeah. So I really, got lucky. when I went to yoga teacher training, I studied with someone named Alan Finger at Ishta and his, his meditations are on Spotify so you can listen to them.

Freddie Kimmel and Pamela Gold (29:01.027)
So that's what started it and that's when I started establishing kind of a daily 18 minute no matter what I would listen to one of his meditations and that really kind of set the stage but about three and a half years ago I read autobiography of a yogi by Yogananda which is a life-changing book if if anyone hasn't read it you're nodding your head so I know that you know it in that book he talks about Kriya and Alan Finger taught me a bunch of Kriyas but

I could tell that there was something specific and different that Yogananda was speaking of. And so I found a teacher in New York City who taught me the very simple Kriya techniques in the same lineage that Yogananda, Hariharinanda, Shriktashur were part of. And there's seven different levels of Kriya practices that become more more more subtle. I'm on the second. After one time meditating the first, I was like, boy.

You know, it was just like a next level. So the meditation specifically has evolved, but there's still a daily, at least 20 minute, very simple set of, you know, where you focus, how you breathe mantras that just be at more and more subtle that really connect me to a deep source of clarity, wisdom, love, bravery. And it has, yeah, it has been pretty.

game changing. know it's easy to get caught up as an entrepreneur of that race and hustle of making this thing fly. That's scary being an entrepreneur is not for the faint of heart. Every time you have to pay payroll or pay the rent, it's like, yeah, I know. I know, but it's, it's those times when, know, you're, I guess our programming from everything we've seen in stories and television and our parents that, you know, it's, it's time to

burn the candle at both ends and not go to bed and, you know, make phone calls. But it's so imperative. Anytime I get in that cycle, if I sit back and I just go sit, I breathe for 10 to 20 minutes, I get answers. Yeah. Isn't it? It's, it's so profound and it becomes so simple if we practice it, right? And it's a practice like everything else. Like if you learn to play the piano, you don't just sit down and suddenly you can play a concerto. You have to

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practice and stumble through. But once you get to a certain level of ability to be quiet and to be still and to connect with that quieter voice, that quieter knowing, and to be able to discern between, you know, the brain, the mind, the egoic voice, which can be quite loud and quite sure. Um, and the subtle quiet knowing it is just, it's such a powerful tool to guide us

through, you know, really something that is quite messy. mean, being human is quite, quite, quite messy running a business, opening a business. mean, the mind will continue to have very unhelpful thoughts like the imposter syndrome thoughts, you know, who am I or someone better is going to come do it and steal everything. I mean, there's like a million thoughts a day that the brain will continue to have and to be able to tap into the deeper wisdom to know which thoughts are helpful and of service and true.

and which thoughts are not, and to not waste even a single second of energy on those unhelpful thoughts. And like you said, when you aren't clear on an answer that you can ask, and sometimes you have to be patient, doesn't always come right away. And not knowing and facing not knowing is a beautiful practice and being at peace with having to wait in that space of not knowing in that moment.

but just knowing that even in that moment of not knowing the answer will come and to be grateful. And, you know, the timing is in God's hands or whatever you believe God to be the seasons of the universe, right? Timing is not something that is humans we can force, but just know that it's on order. that analogy, which I'm sure you've used when you go to a restaurant and you place an order, you don't like sit there at the table worrying after you place your, your order of a salad, whether or not that

the salad's actually going to make it and whether the salad is going to be made the way that you want it. And if it's going to be a good salad. I mean, how neurotic would that be if you place the order? Yes. So yes. but that's one of my favorite analogies for meditation and Zen and manifesting that, you you place the order and you know that it's in the works and it may not come exactly how you, how you ordered it. Like,

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It may come not with the sunflower seeds, with peanuts or whatever, silly analogy, but you see what I'm saying. But just trust that whatever comes is going to be even better than what you had designed. And in the moment, if you judge it not to be, know that that judgment is out of flow and stay in a place of gratitude, stay in a place of openness and surrender and curiosity and love and allow the unexpected challenge

to be the gift that it always is. Yeah. And is, I know people could hear that and be like, well, that's woo woo. You know, it's somewhere off in the ether. You can tie this all into quantum mechanics. yeah. And how every single

atom and particle is related to every other one it's ever been in contact with. mean, the interconnectedness of the universe is real. entanglement is real. They can't explain it. So I was a microbiology biochem major at Yale. I studied science. I was obsessed with science, studied quantum physics. Once you start studying quantum physics, you realize that everything that we kind of were relying on as

fact and truth and the reliable source of expectations. If this, then that you realize if you understand quantum physics at all that like, Oh, no, it's not that simple at all. In fact, funny parenting story. My daughter and I were reading a, you know, a children's biography on Albert Einstein. I think she was nine at the time. And at the end of it, I decided to explain quantum physics to her and some of the principles and my kids are pretty freaking cool. So my daughter,

immediately understood it and it was before bedtime and she jumped up on the bed and she freaked out. She like freaked out. She's like, wait, so this isn't really here and I have time and space and, and she, I was like, Ooh, this was not my best parenting move to explain quantum physics at bedtime to a nine year old, like the poor kid. was like, okay, I'm sorry. Come here. We're real. We're here. I'm here. I'm real. You're, you're okay. It's like bad trip. Um, but yeah, but yeah, once you, once you start, even if you, if you study, um,

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like quantum computers and quantum code breaking. don't know if you've seen any documentaries on that. little bit. Really, really cool stuff. It demonstrates that by observing something, you instantly are changing its properties. So, well, what are you going to do with that? know, like if simply by observing it, you change its qualities and that's just truth, then that explains a lot of the powers that seem to be woo woo.

but actually are not. No, they're not. remember this. There's a children's cartoon on YouTube about the quantum observer and they they fire a particle through a slit in a sheet of metal and you would think it would go through and make a dot on the other side of the wall where the particle went through. But when it goes through the slit, it turns into a wave and it starts, you know, it makes this big broadcast.

but then if you stand on the other side of the board and you look at it, then it goes into a different pattern. It's it's the behavior of the particle change because we're looking at it. it's observed or not observed. my goodness. And no one can explain that in quantum entanglement. You can't explain how two electrons that are eons away from each other in time and space instantly, if you turn one, the other one will re rotate. Like you can't.

that can't be explained by anything that we really understand in this realm. So that's when I was like, all right, so science isn't going to get me there. I think meditation might be a good, a good thing to, and then to me, I look at meditation as like a spiritual science. So I know that I can do experiments and I can record my observations, how I feel, what I experience. And then there's all this independent verification. Like there's such a consistency.

once people start going into deep meditation, what people experience. And so I always encourage people just do their own experimentation, you know, document, take notes, observe how you feel after you meditate, observe what you experience. Do you see light? Do you see light sometimes? Do you ever become the light? I'm just saying, know, weird things happen. but yeah, I mean, it's, just, I am a scientist at heart. I want

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verifiable evidence-based results, because how can I be of service to other people if I'm not using evidence-based verifiable techniques? So everything that I use at HACT is based in science and evidence-based research. And some of the stuff science can't really explain, then I use my own experience and the experience of, in this case, like the 50 people so far that I've had demo it.

Right? And so I am taking notes and I'm recording and that's my science. Right? And that's because at the end of the day, I do this because I care. I want to bring the things that helped me to others. So, I mean, that's the core principle of it all. That's amazing. You know, the other benefit I know, just to speak to meditation again, and people will say, well, I tried to meditate and it didn't work for me. was me. I was convinced. And I've been there too.

But there's also, you can look at it a hundred different ways. And I like to tell people this story. If you think about, your brain is really what we're operating on now is 95 % programs. And it's really, we don't need to remember or relearn how to walk down the street. That's a program. We've got lots of programs for how we process emotion and speak to other human beings. And there's a big part of our subconscious that is running on that programming.

And the two ways which you touched on, can practice like the piano, we can practice every single day, practice, practice, practice. But we can also drop our brains into that theta state, that theta state where we're allowed to put a new program into the brain. And that like your little kid from zero to seven is where they're living in theta. Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, that's...

That's what I experience when I meditate. And also when I do PMF, I drop in and I feel that I, you know, I say it like an upgrade, like when your phone updates, it's like 1.0, Pam 2.0, Pam 3.0 and those old programs that were buggy and not of service, I can get out and replace with the programming that is in harmony with wisdom and love and bravery. And then I can be more of service. It's pretty good stuff. Yeah. I had a woman say to me the other day on an Instagram, I had posted something about

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pulsed electromagnetic field and she said, well, listen, I'm a scientist and I'm not sure I buy into all this PEMF stuff. And I said, well, you should know that the earth generates the pulsed electromagnetic frequency from the core, you know, at varying varying degrees of intensity. And this is something that the human body actually thrives off of. And then she said, well, why do I need PEMF? I said, well,

You don't have to have it, but if you consider, think the first astronaut that went into space had lost almost, it was like 70 % of his muscle mass because he was away from the Earth's natural magnetics. you start to see, well, I'm designed and thrive the way I thrive because I am part of the planet. Yeah, it's all connected. And you know, I was really skeptical about PEMF because again, I was looking at the science.

and didn't really make sense just from what the materials that I had seen. And so for me, that's when I was like, let me just try it. Let me experience it for myself and see how I feel and how I felt and the experience that I had with it was what ultimately convinced me. so, I mean, again, like I am a scientist and I do like to be able to connect the dots and I'm sure we have some differing kind of like what really convinces us or what doesn't, which is totally fine.

I was raised in a very skeptic kind of environment. And so like, get skeptics and, and it's, I'm, I'm fine with skeptics. It's all good. What I really like to say to skeptics, because if you're really like really trying with the science, you may just not get there. So I just try it. Like just, just try it and see how you feel. Right? Like it's really vital for all of us to stay open and be curious.

And for me, I mean, I definitely, my college years are obviously from like, try it. But like, but seriously, like the PMF has never been shown to hurt anybody. So just try it and see how you feel and trust yourself and be open to some of this stuff, even though you may not understand the science or you may have learned other things that seem to make you think that it wouldn't be possible. Plenty of people come in here and tell me it's impossible.

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that I could work out for 20 minutes on that machine and be so strong. It's impossible that you could work out for 40 minutes and be in such good shape. Oh, you can only do that because you were already in good shape. I'm like, no, no, my body's really different, let me tell you. But that's the thing, we have all of these beliefs, and so I'm a big fan of just asking really good questions. How do I know that that is true? And why do I really think that? And is this actually empowering me?

Because if you're, if you're not trying something or not being open to something that has the potential to help you and isn't going to hurt you, what's the harm in trying it? You know, like why would you not, why would you be closed minded to anything that could help you be a better human, live a better life? Why? Yeah. And I think that's what the essence of that I love about hacked is that you can, you can upgrade

the mind and the spirit and the meat suit. And then what do you do with all that extra time? Yeah, that's what I'm so passionate about. It's like, you know, the people that come in here are amazing humans and they're overachievers in all these different zones of genius in their bubbles. And like, because they have more time, because they're operating at a higher level of vitality, physical strength, mental strength, and spiritual strength, they can go back out into their lives and do more good.

And so whether you're a mom or whether you're an author or whether you're running a company, whatever it is that you're doing, you have more life force and more time to go do it, which is really freaking cool. And then a lot of people are like, well, Pam, I just love to work out. like, that's great. Me too. And maybe, you know, soon you'll be inspired to do something else that you really, really love that you're not tied to. And a lot of people

Unfortunately, you can use working out as an addiction, right? Because it definitely mentally is really, really great for dopamine, really, really great for serotonin. Like you're going to feel really good when you work out. Yeah. And there's other things in life that can make you feel really good. You can feel really good when you're tapped into your real life purpose and creative genius. It feels really good to be in the flow doing that even better than using a workout to give you that dopamine hit. No, it's, it's absolutely incredible. And I know

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For me, when I had first moved to New York and you're around so many people and at the same time, you're so alone because you're in your little separate apartment. And for me, it was easy. I remember myself and I moved here the month 9-11. That was the month I chose to come and try to be on Broadway. So it was so heavy.

Yeah, it was so heavy and I was in 9-11 was just I was in such an end path and I didn't know it at that time but being here I just remember like, you know going home at the end of the day and just like laying in the shower and just crying. Yeah, never experiencing those emotions as a 23 year old guy. Yeah, and but going to the gym. Yeah, like being with the community and working out if that will honestly that was one of the few times I felt normal. Yeah, we're going to go in it was the community that I was longing for. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, the community, the physical activity, I mean, it really checks a lot of boxes and it's look, and it's way healthier than, than other many other options that, that humans use to try to feel better. so, but yeah, I mean, gosh, moving here on nine 11, I mean, New York city that month, that need that six months, it was a really heavy time to be here. But yeah, I mean, I guess I look, I look at everything about life that, you know, being in the flow, you know, finding what

know, lights us up following what sparks joy, trusting the process, right? Like trying to be non-judgmental, which is really hard because our minds are wired to be judgmental, but just kind of like allowing it to flow. And I really feel like I, I wrote a book where there's five kind of key inner strength practices and it's not rocket science, but if you practice gratitude, if you practice courage, if you practice compassion, if you practice surrender, which is the hardest, and you practice openness and curiosity,

you'll keep leveling up from the inside out, which will enable you to do more from the outside in because life is going to continue to throw you these challenges, right? And so, I one of the things I like to do is, is explain that connection between the inner strength workout, the mental strength workout and the physical strength workout. Because all of this goes so hand in hand when it comes to us finding

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what we want our kind of legacy to be, whether we're still trying to find our life purpose or whether we even maybe believe in that, but like, what is our life all about? Because we all know we're going to die at one point. We're going to, maybe we'll have time to reflect right before, or maybe it'll be really fast, but it's, all going to go there. And I visualize that a lot. think about like, well, if, this were my last moment, you know, how would I feel? Would I be, would I feel good? You know, saying that this is the legacy I left and

So that's kind of what I encourage everybody to do, kind of a somber thing to do at a gym, but like it all goes hand in hand. And so, mean, it's again, I don't think you can separate any of this stuff out. And I think I try to give people what they think they need. So a lot of people come in here just cause I can give them a workout really fast, but there's so much more, more to it, you know? Yeah. Well, I'm excited for people to get down here and experience hacked. Thank you. I'm so impressed. This is my first day in.

Thank you. It's been so much fun having here. I mean, you've already made a bunch of new friends. It was kind of magical just from the time you walked in. It's a magical place. There's really awesome people that come in here. I we get some really, really impressive, uber high achieving people that get what we're doing here and are pretty psyched that they have access to all this tech that normally, you you hear about it on podcasts, know, billionaires have access to it.

You probably have a lot of it in your house. I do. I do. I could spill the cookie jar on that. I do have some of these devices in my house. I don't have the ARX, but you know, I have a, I have a good amount of tech that I've used to biohack my body back into peak performance. So, know, it was expensive. And so people are psyched that they can come and try it out here. We're the only place in New York city that has a lot of this stuff. We're the only, you know, gym in New York city that focuses on biohacking. So it's a pretty unique.

unique and special spot. Yeah, no, and it really does. You know, I, I, I pursue it. I talk about it. I prophesize it because it, works. I see it work on people again and again. And the story that I get, because I come from the chronic illness background and, know, we, we chase, you chase feeling better. You chase wellness and everybody's spent a couple hundred thousand dollars chasing, just trying to feel normal. The, the trap is to

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try to get back to before, which is the observer, you know that it's just never gonna feel that way. But you you chase wellness and then things start to shift and finally you're gonna find your special sauce and you're gonna get there. It's just, I just believe in it and I believe in the community you're creating. I love that people have access to, guys, everything you've heard on Dave Asprey or Ben Greenfield,

Joe Rogan podcast all these cool machines are down here at hacked. Give us what's your address at hacked? Sure. We're at 226 Seventh Avenue. So it's Seventh Avenue and 23rd Street Seventh Avenue and 23rd Street and so people can come down they can demo some things you guys can try a six-week program I would implore everybody to come down when you hear this mentioned beautifully broken podcast just because

We want to connect the circle. Yeah, we'll give you 10 % off if you mention it. All right. We didn't even plan that discount. And, know, just for my end, just think, you know, here's the other thing like Pam. So people don't know Pam's jacked. Pam, I feel no, I'm serious biceps for days. I'm going to I'm going to have to do a six week program on the A.R.X. and up level. Yeah. Well, you know what I have to tell you?

First of all, we want to love our body and our body is for us, right? So like there's, there will never be a time, no matter what your body looks like, that there's not going to be critics, that there's not going to be people that are like, you know, critical of how your body looks, right? So you have to love it for you. And I get like how it looks, the aesthetic is important. But for me, even more important than how I look is how I feel. And feeling strong, knowing that I can take something on.

Right. And I have that strength, that physical strength to handle stuff. Like that is an awesome feeling. It's like, yeah, it's nice put on jeans and heels or dress or whatever, you know, look good and be shapely and all that fun stuff. even more important is how it feels to be strong and to really be in your body and trust your body and love your body and know that your body is thriving. Really good feeling.

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Yeah, no, my goal is to be able to grocery shop till I'm 90. Yes, that's solid goal. I like it. Yeah. So I know we're going to do this again because you have so many cool things here and we're in alignment and I know you're going to have more stuff in the future. I can already imagine how this is going to evolve with this community. More locations and it's going to be good. I'm so excited for people to have access to this. It's going to be so good. So it's this is this is definitely

It's definitely one of my dreams, but I'm glad you're doing it. And I know how hard it is and how much love and how much passion you've poured into this. So you are an official friend of the podcast and I thank you for being here. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. Thank you so much, Pam. Namaste. Namaste. This episode of the Beautifully Broken podcast was brought to you by our lovely sponsor, AmpCoil. Guys, a heartfelt thank you for tuning in.

If you enjoyed today's show, if you found yourself moved and inspired, I would ask that your next stop today is to drop a review on iTunes. Nothing helps a movement like sharing, downloading, and spreading this message. You can follow me on freddysetgo on all social platforms and throwing a screenshot and a favorite quote of your episode in your Insta story or on Facebook. That is the extra credit next level engagement I am manifesting. So like these little ripples in a pond your action helps connect this inspired information with the people who need it most. Till next time. I'm your host, Freddie Kimmel. This is a beautifully broken podcast. Namaste.