Fascia, Cadaver Labs & Peptides: Lauren Sambataro (BioHacker Babes) on Why More Health Data Isn't Working

WELCOME TO EPISODE 303

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Freddie Kimmel (00:01.322)
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Beautifully Broken podcast. I'm back with my good friend Lauren Sambataro.

Lauren (00:11.054)
Tarot. Tarot root. Tarot card.

Freddie Kimmel (00:14.016)
No, that's not your last name anymore.

Lauren (00:17.01)
it's not not not my

Freddie Kimmel (00:18.38)
What's your what's what is what is your last name on your email?

Lauren (00:22.852)
My legal name is Woodard. Is that what you were asking? My married name. Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (00:26.764)
Yes. Yep. I was thinking about your marriage of which I attended and you gave me this beautiful bathroom bag. And I've used it up until last weekend when it broke.

Lauren (00:41.242)
the zipper?

Freddie Kimmel (00:42.604)
I know. The zipper broke.

Lauren (00:45.644)
Zippers aren't forever.

Freddie Kimmel (00:47.38)
Zip That sounds like a song. That's also a good band name.

Lauren (00:51.844)
Well thank you for the idea. In case I start my band I will not have to search. It's got

Freddie Kimmel (00:57.877)
Zippers are forever. Lauren, for anybody who hasn't heard one of your previous episodes with you or your sister, you're part of the BioHacker Babes, a w a little wellness sister collective. if we bumped into each other at let's say we're at a we're at a big wellness conference, we're at A four in Las Vegas, what would you tell me that you do? How do you spend your time in the world of wellness?

Lauren (01:22.416)
I would say, and this changes day to day, but I'm a functional health practitioner. I work one on one to one with clients virtually. So I can work with clients all over the world. and I take a systems levels approach where I help people that don't feel well feel better and get to know why they're not feeling their best. So I have a lot of tools in the toolbox because we work on nutrition, mindset, exercise, sleep. the tools involve sometimes

psychedelics, sometimes it's biohacking tech, sometimes it's just listening to a person. So we pull out the tool that is right for the person. And basically I'm a bridge between a health coach and a doctor where I can help you get to the root causes of why you're not feeling the way that you want to feel essentially. Sometimes that's lab work. but I am that bridge. I'm a mirror and I am a health detective in a lot of ways.

Freddie Kimmel (02:16.959)
I love that. I love that. Do you think your understanding of of how you facilitate that that expert level guided assistance, holding up a mirror for people, do you think that's changed a lot in the last ten years?

Lauren (02:31.295)
yeah. Yeah. Big time. Yeah, it it's always like a few steps behind my own health journey. And I think that's for a lot of us in this space. We are helping ourselves, we're solving a problem in our own life, and then we get to turn around and go, like, hey, this worked for me. which is a beautiful thing. The problem is that sometimes we can get stuck in our own path and say, Well, this works for me. This has gotta work for you. And we always have blind spots. So

that has changed for me because I've had a lot of blind spots. I've had a lot of aha mo aha moments and then there were still blind spots. I'm sure I could name a few examples, but like I a big turning point in my health was discovering lab work. I was doing what everyone else was doing. I was doing the conventional advice, what was very popular in the media, which in you know the early 2000s in New York was like go, go, go, do more. There was no such thing as recovery. We didn't talk about that. We didn't talk about recovery biohacking, we didn't talk about mindset thought patterns.

and I thought that I solved my burnout by looking at my labs. I said, I have like objective data that tells me of course this is why I felt burnt out, which was a huge piece of the puzzle. Now, you know, twelve years later I'm like, Ooh, that was a small piece of the puzzle. A very important piece of the puzzle. But I think to answer your question, yes, I'm always learning, I'm always like expanding the lens, I'm always expanding the viewpoint from which I look at my health and other people's health. So yeah, I'm I'm not the same coach I once was.

Freddie Kimmel (04:00.637)
Yeah. Yeah, I think about how it used to feel relatively simple because we would talk about healthy food swaps and we would talk about trying exercise and we would talk about, you know, it was like ten, twelve years ago. And it's definitely the level of complexity and the interest in some of the high level stuff has accelerated, I find, within the public. Like

People come educated understanding that there is a hormonal piece. People come educated knowing that there are high level interventions like peptides or eBU or high powered PENF devices. And back in the day, that was like very, very, very fringe. It was only when you were really sick and that you were driven to those interventions would you even be having those conversations. And now today I'm like, I literally just got off the phone call in which this massive company is going to be

launching the Amazon of peptide services to dramatically bring down costs for anyone and everyone with a US lab and Dr. Coaching included and they're trying to make it affordable for your average American. And so we're talking fractions of of the current price model which exists in the world of peptides. It's wild. It's wild. It's just changed so fast. All that being said

Lauren (05:17.635)
It's incredible.

Freddie Kimmel (05:24.207)
I get on here every week and we we eventually come to this point where like, I'm not sure people are getting better health outcomes. I'm not sure we're changing yeah, right? Right.

Lauren (05:31.65)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We have more information and more accessibility than we've ever had. And I think that's serving a lot of sick people. We need more opportunity. We need more solutions. But is it taking us further away from the answer? In a lot of cases, I think yes. I think we've overcomplicated a lot of things. Peptides are really cool. But

Freddie Kimmel (05:56.239)
Yeah.

Lauren (06:00.054)
It's giving another piece of candy that is like, you know, dangling a a a dopamine hit in front of the average human and that's what we're all sort of wired for is like a quick fix, a dopamine hit, something that feels fun and feels popular, whether we say we do that or not. I think we all are a little bit wired for that. Yeah, so so solutions, more solutions does not mean we have the solution, unfortunately.

Freddie Kimmel (06:25.347)
Yeah. Like when I was a when I was initially like coaching and this is like I think I got my ISSA certification like two thousand seven. Wow. Two thousand eight, something like that. Wow. I was really focused on body transformations. It was like I wanna clean up your food and your water and your movement so your body would transform. And and now I know so many people that are like it myself included, right? That are

Lauren (06:34.871)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lauren (06:42.755)
Same.

Freddie Kimmel (06:53.984)
at the time where I was real I was really in phenomenal shape. I had like an eight pack when I was diagnosed with cancer. And I see people today having heart attacks and strokes and are incredible, incredible shape. And so a lot of that that ideology or that idea that my yardstick for truth with just like body composition is like long gone out the window, that that's a sole priority. It doesn't mean it's not part of the picture. But now it's like what's your respiratory rate?

What's your sleep cycle look like? How's your REM? You know, all what's your HRV? You know, w all the things. Can you can you get off the floor without using your hands from a dead set? There's different yardsticks. That's a very good stick. But you know, it but then now there's things like we've known for a long time that grip strength was a predictor of longevity, but now you have people practicing grip strength.

Lauren (07:35.361)
That's a very good skill to have. I like that one. I really like that one.

Freddie Kimmel (07:48.973)
thinking that if their grip strength is really strong, that's gonna correlate to a longer life when in actuality now you've changed the value of that metric 'cause grip strength with the was was a result of a low systemic inflammation or good body mechanics. So it's all like I'm like, man, there's just not enough context or we just need a right.

Lauren (08:09.175)
my God, that's so true. Not enough context. And I I just like I can't not comment on your background right now. I'm just like staring at you with this like perfect little circle of light over your head. And you're just the wisdom is coming through and out of you. I really love your background so much. yeah, I think context is. Did you? You couldn't see it, could you? Could we see it in North America? I don't think we could.

Freddie Kimmel (08:27.798)
This is what wait, this is what the eclipse looked like yesterday.

Freddie Kimmel (08:37.056)
I don't know. I didn't go outside. I worked.

I was h I was healthy all day yesterday. Stayed in my little box, my light controlled box.

Lauren (08:41.195)
Aye.

Lauren (08:45.887)
Yeah. But you have nice materials around you and you have light sources. You're not in a basement, thank God. yeah, context is missing and that's a huge part of why we overcomplicate things. We also, you know, information overloads so we read the headline. And the headline is not the answer. People read the headline and think they have the whole the whole thing, or they hear it once on a podcast and we don't ask why enough, or we don't read the whole text.

And it's no one's fault. We're all trying to help each other. We're trying to help people. A lot of people are out there trying to help people, but we've massively overcomplicated it. And I think that's what I I like to do and I enjoy to do. And I also am like the victim of it. I think that I, of course, am looking for a shortcut sometimes and don't see the big picture. so I like to challenge myself to keep stepping back and stepping out. And I I love to do that with clients and challenge, like, why do you believe that?

Is this really true? Like those could be really powerful answers on the health journey. Why do you believe that? Is this really true? Is this actually even working for you? Does this feel good in your body? I just heard something on a podcast like an hour ago, and I was like, my God, I can't believe I've never heard that. I'm gonna start telling people that. And then I went, you know what? I'm gonna do like a little bit more research on that. And I was like, this is not validated. This is why this doesn't make sense. Like, okay, I could spend 30 minutes like.

not programming myself with one bit of information with no context. You know, I heard somebody say it that I trust and believe, therefore it's true.

Freddie Kimmel (10:18.877)
What what did you hear? Now I'm curious, now I gotta know.

Lauren (10:21.635)
Bruce Lipton, who I love very much. And if your audience doesn't know about Bruce Lipton, I highly encourage people to listen to him. But I think even people like that that are world-renowned and extremely intelligent and have a lot to offer could maybe say something that you still need to do a little more research on. He said that if you cross one particular arm over the other, that you could be activating.

Freddie Kimmel (10:27.05)
Love Rus.

Lauren (10:49.759)
Activating a certain hemisphere of your brain. So we know left-right hemisphere controls opposite side of the brain, right? So that's why like contralateral movement is really helpful because we we balance the hemispheres, but we could also activate one hemisphere that maybe is not as activated. But that's a weird statement. Like I think both hemispheres are always working and connecting to each other. He said, Notice when you cross your arms if one is over the other.

Because that could be like a subconscious programming or or it could be a choice to activate the other side. What I learned is from a neuroscience perspective, that's not validated, but perhaps like energetically, somatically, it could be something that you notice about someone, or it could just be, you know, if you're always crossing one arm and you cross the other one over, do you feel weird? What is the weird? Why do you feel weird? Can you be with the weird?

Freddie Kimmel (11:20.307)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (11:39.706)
I don't like e I don't like either way. It actually it makes me I feel a little I feel a contract I feel a closing in my heart center when I close my arms. Just now sitting here. I will do it, but it's w when I'm it's when I'm frustrated. I will stand there and I'm like in a fight with Cynthia and I'm like cross my arms. Close it off. Yeah.

Lauren (12:01.123)
Well crossing your arms is a form of protection, right? Like we are we are self soothing, we are closing our heart. It is our way of survival in a perhaps threatening environment. And then you go to meditation and they say, Uncross your arms, like put your feet on the ground, be open, be open to receiving. So is this open good and this is bad? No.

Freddie Kimmel (12:10.236)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (12:16.897)
Mm.

Lauren (12:23.725)
There are situations where like crossing your arms is very protective and needed in in that instance. So I think he was just bringing a attention to the fact that we should pay attention to body language and we do have control over the way that we receive and also the way that we emit our own energy. But like to empirically say that right over left is connecting and activating the left is not a scientifically validated statement.

Freddie Kimmel (12:33.245)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (12:46.586)
Yeah. Yeah, and I think that's the danger with taking health advice from any podcast is running with it as a new operating principle as opposed to like what you did, you're like, this is a jumping off point for me to go explore that. Is there validity behind that as as far as the brain goes? Because the storytelling component I find of what I tell myself is is good and bad is is can be medicine or poison.

Lauren (13:14.007)
Yeah, and a lot of that is subconscious, right? Like how do we even begin to label good and bad? It's completely subjective. And it is your I it it is your own subconscious that determines that. That's why we get into conflict because our agreement on what is good and bad is probably different. That's what that's what makes us unique, and that also brings us into conflict with other people, but also with our own health, too, right?

Freddie Kimmel (13:16.368)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (13:20.123)
That's right.

Freddie Kimmel (13:36.08)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (13:39.856)
Yeah.

Lauren (13:41.88)
Things that I've done wrong and gotten wrong about my health is I've gotten stuck to labels. Like let's just take for an example, looking at data. Data is really fun, right? Like getting feedback on the body. It can be great in so many ways. It reveals blind spots, it gives us feedback, it can be a tool for behavior change. But

Freddie Kimmel (14:00.315)
Can you give me a specific when you say data just for fun? You're like, let's talk about the Dutch test or let's talk about my C B C or

Lauren (14:05.93)
Let's look at my aura ring and my deep sleep.

Freddie Kimmel (14:09.229)
Okay.

Lauren (14:13.164)
Readiness score. I think that's better. That has tends to have like more of a an emotional impact on me. I wake up, I check my aura, I see that readiness score, I feel good, but then I see the score and I'm like, nope, it's gonna be a bad day. That's a simple example. I'm sure we could think of a lot of them, but we could use that objective data in the wrong way. And if we are very vulnerable, which we all are, we're all subjective to programming.

Freddie Kimmel (14:16.1)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (14:30.616)
Yeah.

Lauren (14:38.19)
Which is why we have to be careful with what we consume, the media that we watch, the people that we talk to, the environments that we step into. Like our cells are little receivers, they're constantly seeking information. And so we have to be very careful with that information that our body is receiving because it can become story. And then your subconscious learns that that's the story, and then before you even know it, of course you can't will yourself to change. You can't work so hard to change because your subconscious is operating under another story.

So for me, I'm in this new era of like leaning away from the data, even though I freaking love data so much. I think it's fun and fascinating. but I'm leaning away from it because I I started feeling like it was controlling me a little bit. I don't know if you felt like that with your data. I know you you love your sleep score, but you have like a hundred on your sleep score all the time. I'm like, that is a that is positive reinforcement. You're like, I'm gonna check that baby every day.

Freddie Kimmel (15:25.881)
It's it's so good.

Freddie Kimmel (15:34.297)
Well, listen, from being a problem sleeper when I when I really started to tank around two thousand fourteen and when neurological Lyme and and I'd really just struggling to just the the brain fog was so intense. I I just couldn't sleep through the night. And so to now be in a position where like every night I got a ninety six or ninety eight or a hundred for almost a full calendar year

I just feel so happy about it. So a lot of times, audience, if you follow, I will post my sleep score and my recovery metric and my oxygenation and my low respiratory rate and my high HRV. And I'll say, you know, I'll put like a little unicorn on there because I'm I'm just happy, right? it is not every night. I just did a podcast and I was just talking about I think on episode three hundred I was and I know I mentioned it last week too, so we'll do it a third time 'cause I'm gonna repeat myself.

Lauren (16:02.5)
Amazing.

Freddie Kimmel (16:32.147)
that just not eating four hours before sleep for me has been the single greatest mover of HRV that I've ever done. sleep score aside, just giving my body time because my transit time for me is slow. Having a resection of your intestine is gonna slow that down. I do all these unique things, anywhere from a castor oil pack to a tonifying herb for my bowels or maybe a like a mag 07 magnesium oxide to help with transit time.

Lauren (16:39.364)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (17:01.374)
And that's what I need to do to have regular bowel movements and complete bowel movements. but but the but the eating gap for me is like profound because it gives that motor migrating complex with there's this wave when we go into deep sleep, moving that food along. And then my body is not breaking down that nighttime meal. It's repairing proteins, it's draining the the cellular waste or exhaust of the brain, all the good things. So I've just

I'm like gonna beat that drum for a while now. Now that's not everybody. Lots of people need some type of a a glucose or a carb or a little bit of protein before bed to sleep through the night. So my protocol, my experience is not your protocol.

Lauren (17:43.96)
And that was my favorite thing about what you just said, because I too operate under that four-hour rule, maybe even more, but you kept saying, for me, for me. Can you imagine if every every educator, influencer, thought leader made a statement and said, Because for me, and here is why. You said, I do this, because that is what my body needs, and this is why. This is how the migrating motor complex works.

So you shared an experience, you said, This is my personal experience, maybe that resonates with you, and here's some science. But many people online are not following that format. We're speaking in absolutes. And that gets attention, you know, that makes waves, that sticks in people's minds and makes impressions. But if you don't hear the for me, you just assume it's for me.

And then you may do and you're like, that didn't that didn't work. And then you reinforce this like, well, that didn't work and that didn't work and that didn't work. Nothing's gonna work for me. So what story are we telling ourselves over and over again? Because we didn't t we were not told that it wasn't that for us. Such a disservice.

Freddie Kimmel (18:42.82)
That's right. That's that's right.

I know. I know it's it's it's tough. You know, there's a lot of I was thinking about all week. I have an ice bath running all day, every day outside. It's ready to ready to go. And and normally the way I've used it for a big chunk of time over the last year is that when I wake up in the morning, I try to get outside for an outdoor shower and get my morning light. Like within five minutes of waking up. So for me, I take a long shower, I'm out out there ten minutes

I'll just get in the ice bath, which is at like fifty two degrees. There's not floating chunks of ice. And it's just a great way to wake up. I'm like, Woo, holy cow, let's go. but I've been ha

Lauren (19:26.648)
I've witnessed that. I've witnessed the screaming and you like really are just a a bundle of joy. It's wonderful.

Freddie Kimmel (19:31.672)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have I have fun with it and I'm all by myself. I'm like entertaining myself. But there's been a lot of noise online. Like there are people that making they're they're making an amplification of their platform by telling women like ice baths are bad. Or there's men telling people that ice baths are for everyone. And I you know, I was just like, Well, you know, maybe it's not that great. I'm gonna tell you what.

I was having these tension headaches and it's usually driven by when I work out. I I my traps you can literally see my traps from here. They're like they just get fired up. So when I do pull ups, one arm rows, anything back, I get like a tension headache from the mechanics that I've not figured out yet. I got in an ice bath two days ago and sat down right to the osaput base of my spine and I was in there for four minutes. I hadn't done that in a long time.

I was pain free. I had like a full day, no pain, no tension headache, no nothing, no pills, no machines. I was like, this is incredible. And it's worked every time I start to develop that tension index. I I'm just like, for me, God, what a great therapy. Like, and it's not an everyday thing that I'm gonna do a four minute ice bath, but I tell you what, like I love it.

I love contrast therapy. I love going from the hot to the cold. I feel so good. Yeah. Yeah. I needed to reclaim that for myself.

Lauren (20:58.712)
Hmm. I love that. But y you know, you're no, I think that's amazing. I I think ice is a very powerful tool. It is largely a free tool. I mean, you could pay for an expensive tub that has, you know, self-cleaning and has a chiller and all that stuff. But we have cold water. We have access to that. and it's something that nature provides to us, and I think I think everyone should try it once. I'm a big proponent of try it once, listen to your body.

But I think sometimes people try it once and then they hear someone say, That's not good for a person like you. And it's like they were almost looking for that feedback to feed their bias. And then they go, see, see I knew it wasn't for me, so I'm never gonna do it again.

Freddie Kimmel (21:41.422)
Yeah, context over content. I I can't I can't not fall into this. I'm I'm gonna lean into this wall a little bit. For the grayer portion of human beings walking on their feet, we bathed in really cold water, and that's when we bathed. It was cold, it was not heated, full stop. it's not gonna hurt your physiology, it's not gonna hurt your microbiome, it's not that you have a broken nervous system. I just

Lauren (21:58.094)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (22:06.851)
don't believe that that is there is anything ill associated with it. I mean, y I understand that anything done in excess can be bad, but I think the evol this evolution of health, I would welcome other people to come on board and say, let's stop demonizing things that nature has offered to us and let's start looking at the relationship we have to those things and just stop there. And just be liberated, be liberated from the Stacey Sims, be liberated from all the other people that are like

Lauren (22:30.02)
Hm.

Freddie Kimmel (22:36.557)
You know, you're good, you're bad, this is awful. You don't need that. It's not it's not knowledge. It's filtered information for somebody who's working in a very specific lens. You know? And that's like you're gonna see people keep th there's certain people in the in the vertical that are like, I'm gonna pick this next sixty days with my social media team and we're gonna champion a new thing that I think is bad for people. Back in the day it was like we all were kind of everybody who was in a health was collectively like, Well, let's

Lauren (22:47.748)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (23:06.434)
Let's not eat candy bars, guys. And there was everybody was on board with that. And now now it's been now we've evolved to a place where it's like to have eyes on your content, you need to say something inflamm inflammatory.

Lauren (23:20.024)
Contrarian, controversial, you gotta tell people they're doing something wrong. That's what gets views. I remember when I first got on Instagram and I was encouraged to do so by a mentor of mine, and I was like, that's kind of a scary, vulnerable place. I don't wanna do that. And I started out posting, you know, posed fitness photos, you know, me and nature doing a lunge. And then I'd have like an like an inspirational quote underneath. You know, it was

And I kinda laugh at it, like, God, what was I doing then? But it was so light. The content was light. It was like a nice, beautiful photo. We all deserve to look at beautiful things in nature and symmetry. And I it was an inspiring quote. Like so the opposite of what the internet is now. I kinda wanna go back to that, but I won't get any views, you know? Just me working out like I don't know, quoting Roomy or something. But yeah, and you see these trends. Like right now, I'm so in it right now because as a female, like

Freddie Kimmel (23:57.645)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (24:02.625)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (24:07.714)
Yeah.

Lauren (24:14.062)
The whole iron ferritin conversation is so huge and it's like one one person picked it up and so now everybody's posting about it. This is why your iron is low and this is what you're missing. I I'm like, you're all missing it. You're all missing the picture. It's it's bioindividual. I think people are saying good things, but we're not looking at bioindividuality. We're not talking to the bio individual of cells, of experiences, of of mindset, of story, of narrative.

And I think that's the beauty of working one on one with someone. You're not gonna get answers for you on social media. Maybe I don't know, maybe your algorithm is wide enough that you'll see something that's outside of your purview and go, hmm, what's that? But not I I don't think it's designed. I think it's designed to feed your bias and keep you sort of in the same thought processes, unfortunately. But I I long for a simpler time on social media.

Freddie Kimmel (25:11.005)
I keep saying this phrase in my head when I when I go in 'cause usually when I go into the phone it's when I'm a little low energy when there's a lull and I can feel myself of like, well, let me go see if I've got any DMs or how the post did today or and I'll be pulled in and then I'm give me a quick little hit, but then I'm in a rabbit hole and I c I and I've stopped myself like the last couple of weeks and I just say, There's nothing here for you. There's nothing good here for you. There's no there's nothing good there's no

Lauren (25:22.468)
Same yeah. Give me a quick little hit.

Lauren (25:34.19)
Mm, mm.

Freddie Kimmel (25:38.612)
groundbreaking topic about there's nothing you're gonna find here. You know? I I've and I've have the hits, right? It's like I can check my crypto portfolio, I can check the stock market, I can check my social media posts, but I'm very aware of what I'm looking for. I'm looking for something exciting. Cause really under that, I'm actually tired. I actually probably it's a good time to like go pull the curtains back, lay in total darkness, go do like a little

Lauren (25:55.288)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (26:07.838)
Find my resonant breath rate, right? I listened to your podcast with Dr. J. Wiles and your sister and downloaded the optimal HRV and got a chest strap and I've been playing around with that resonance breathing rate. And man, does that chill me out? It chill I'm like it's like a tranquilizer.

Lauren (26:14.7)
Hmm. Love him.

Lauren (26:25.994)
Isn't that so cool? Ooh.

Resonant breathing has like opened up this whole other world to me. And and you know what, Dr. J, I really like him, just wanted to speak about him really quickly. Like, he's been very adamant and a little like inflammatory because he's pissed off that people on the internet are like, This vagus nerve device, or this is how you call him the vagus nerve, you the humming, the gargling. But he's that's a top down approach. We actually need to work from the heart up. And he has a really good point. He has a lot of great education.

I dun I hopefully you will share more with your audience about resonant breathing because it's a whole other way into the nervous system that's way more powerful than what we're being told on social media.

Freddie Kimmel (27:06.556)
Yeah, I've always known that and I've known about finding a resonant breath rate was the one of the quickest ways to tap into my individual state. And I can't remember who said it three or four years ago. And I didn't realize there was a way to test and find it. And so there's this app that essentially takes you through all these different breathing patterns in about fourteen minutes. And it comes up with a pattern for you that probably will change over time. So you're gonna retest it.

But when you find it, like I think mine's five, four or something like that, five five. It, you know, I get like six or seven breaths in and I can feel myself starting to like just drift away. It's just, it's just really amazing. And when I do that practice, I become I actually, it's so funny. On the other side of that, I do have more energy. I just there's less, I'd say there's less bleed or less of a leak.

of leaky energy that's leaking out on other things 'cause I'm really clear on what I want to be focused on. I've really I've really enjoyed it and and so much so that I've just picked up not a resonance breath work, but I've picked back up using the Other Ship free app. There's probably like eight tracks on Other Ship. And that's what I've been doing in the morning. Just just fighting not to go into my phone because man, I can lose forty five minutes so quickly. And I'm like, dude, what are you doing? It's like

Lauren (28:15.178)
good.

Lauren (28:27.779)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (28:28.196)
Time's time's ticking on the old life clock.

Lauren (28:31.358)
I know. I mean there's so much good that you can find on the internet too, right? Like Jeremy, my husband goes there for laughs and it's like so fun to watch. Like he can get lost in his phone, but he's like sitting back and cackling. I'm like, that is so therapeutic. Like he has such a great algorithm. Mine's like health, your dying, your ferritin, your oxygen, these biohacking things you're not doing. And he's just over there laughing. I'm like, he's doing it right, you know?

Freddie Kimmel (28:55.216)
Can you can you tell us a little bit about why iron is coming up as a as a talking point for women and and what's what's the what's the context?

Lauren (29:05.454)
So a lot of women are coming well we're learning now that you need more expansive biomarkers. For the longest time, conventional labs didn't even test iron, and if they did, they just gave you your total iron. And now we need to understand how it's being stored, how it's being metabolized, how it's being transported. So looking at a more comprehensive view, total iron, iron saturation,

Freddie Kimmel (29:24.526)
Mm.

Lauren (29:29.07)
Your total iron binding capacity and then your ferritin. And the ferritin is really your storage form of iron. And that's getting a lot of attention. Why? I don't know. There's this tipping point of information. Somebody started talking about it. Now everyone's talking about it. That I can't fully explain. But it it tends to be quite prevalent in women for I think a lot of reasons. There's a bit of a chicken or the egg situation going on that I don't know that anyone has fully locked down, but I think there's a nervous system component. Women that are stuck in hypervigilance, whether

From a traumatic event, or maybe that was imprinted from birth on, or maybe they're just sort of programmed to be busy, busy, do do do, not enough rest. that's a component. there is a nutritional component. So if you're not absorbing your nutrients, let's just say i.e. you have leaky gut, you're not absorbing nutrients, you are not able to retain minerals and nutrients like an iron.

There's an oxygen component. So there's this again as chicken or the egg, but there's a lot of theories about like sleep apnea and subsets of sleep apnea, like an upper airway resistance. Are we not retaining iron because we're not getting oxygen, which is oxygening the blood? There's a lot of thoughts here. so there's just been light shed on why ferritin is low in women, and it's basically like follow these three steps and we'll fix your iron without addressing the bio individual.

Did I answer your question?

Freddie Kimmel (30:55.137)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's fascinating. It's fascinating. I've definitely never looked at that depth of of a panel around my iron.

Lauren (31:05.048)
And maybe you don't need to, but I think there's a lot of women out there walking around, they're exhausted constantly. And they're like, What? I'm I'm healthy, I go to the gym, I eat well, you know, why am I so tired? And then they test their laps. It's like, God, well, your ferritin is in the basement, and most doctors will tell you if you're if your iron is that low, like of course you don't have good energy. My ferritin actually is quite low, and I have amazing energy, so it's not an absolute like that. and I've been on a on a journey of trying to discover why my

ferritin is not storing properly. I'm on to some hypotheses. But I don't know. You know, the tipping point of the internet is like such an interesting thing. Do you what are you seeing online right now? Because it doesn't sound like you're being fed the iron thing.

Freddie Kimmel (31:49.161)
I'm not. I'm not being fed that story. I mean, I'm just in right now I'd say I'm really into because I'm working in the consulting space and I'm working in you know, essentially I I I make my living

supplying clinics and people with the right devices for their practice. And I'm so I'm doing a lot of teaching, a lot of educating, specifically around lymphatics and high powered P EMF and light. Like those are the one and I'm gonna start working it's funny, I'm gonna start working with a biologics company. I find that people are just we're lost in the sauce of marketing.

You know, and I I just I have laser vision right now for marketing. It's like it's just all a spin. It's so rare that you see something framed with the right contacts. It's like we can never say. Yeah, like you can never say that for example, like Juve is like, we have the only medical grade light on the market. It's like, No, you don't. what is medical grade red light therapy? Tell me more about that. What do you mean? Is it sterile?

Lauren (32:42.66)
Can you give me example?

Lauren (32:54.03)
Hmm. Neither.

Freddie Kimmel (33:00.06)
Is it no, there's that it's just it's the the words and the claims are just the we're they're making them up. We're like in a little we're we're in our l own little silo, kind of spinning around. And everybody in the red light industry is like, we're gonna add blue light, we're gonna add pulse rates, we're gonna add a digital panel, we're gonna allow co the the biggest fraud is allowing a consumer to adjust your visible and near infrared spectrum on a red light panel.

How is a consumer qualified to understand the ratio of the visible to the near infrared spectrum? I want more of this today. I want more of this. And then the the ad running is like, this made me feel great. I love being able to adjust my near infrared. It's crazy. There's no science to support that. You're good enough to have a red light panel that turns on and gives you like, you want some 600s in there, you want some eight hundreds, you want

I I ideally I think I think you want a little more of the the the near infrared. I think you w more of the invisible spectrum that goes a little deeper into the body, and so you get the activation of nitric oxide, you'll get a reduction of pain, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. there's only so much your body can absorb from the physical red light. Now, I'm involved with a red light company and I work with a red light scientist, and so we're always looking at the research, but there's nothing conclusive to this.

Lauren (34:16.697)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (34:25.296)
And so you're having these these companies for the sake of one upmanship add features, acceleration of the vertical to a place that does not it's not supported by much. And so that's one really good example. And so I'm I'm I'm always thinking about how do we ground back down? Like how do we ground back down into the reality of what this is and what it can do? I'm a huge believer in red light therapy. Do you remember

Lauren (34:37.764)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (34:53.662)
Do you remember the panel, the square panel, the rejuvenator? Do you remember that? I had I had like one of the first home devices that was like Leanne Vignier. She sold it. Anyways, it was like an eight hundred dollar plastic panel. It was like a plastic square. It was like very It worked wonders. There was nothing it was a plastic panel. Like

Lauren (34:58.852)
Hm, vaguely.

Vaguely. Hm. Mm mm.

Lauren (35:20.012)
Interesting. We've come a long way.

Freddie Kimmel (35:21.199)
Like literally like I pulled it apart before. It's like there's nothing special about it. it was very low power, but I would put it on my belly, I'd put it on my scar tissue, and I had such great results from pain, from transit time to dysbiosis. I had so many good things happening just from putting that on my belly, and it's something I still do today. And it's it's like that it's like

Lauren (35:43.748)
Amazing.

Freddie Kimmel (35:47.224)
Understand where you're at, what's the pain point, meet the patient, meet the body where they're at, and then pick a solution and then don't waste any more time on it. But right now, an average consumer because red lights in target, right? It's everywhere. So you're being targeted by everybody. They're like, I think this panel's good and this panel's good. There is no best red light panel. I think that'd be really hard to prove. I really do. I've got the best flashlight. Right.

Lauren (36:10.754)
I mean I would argue a very cheap one on Amazon, maybe, but yeah, I think we're getting into wars over just silly things. It's like j I agree with you, get the tool and use it. And also know why you're using it. I think there's people buying stuff and I still don't even know why they're using it. I don't know, someone told me red light's good for my skin. I don't know. Do you have you even heard the word mitochondria? Like, let's do a little bit of research to understand why I'm using this because that's also why we get lost in the sauce.

We're still not asking why. and I'm a huge red light person. I've been using it for as long as I can remember. And that's like one of the original things my dad had in the 80s in our living room, like before biohacking was a thing. It's like this is not not new. It's not new. dogs are the best health optimizers. They will tell you.

Freddie Kimmel (36:49.755)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (36:55.532)
Yeah. Yeah. My puppy asks for it every single morning and he's he's always on

Dogs hip high powered p he's on the magna wave every single day. He sits in the dog bed on the magnum wave pad and looks at you to turn on the machine and when it stops he picks his head up and he's like like he wants it. He feels it. It's not a placebo. He walks over to his bed in front of the red light. You know, a spoiled little puppy has a s six foot by forty eight inch foot red light wall. But his no his snout is like touched up against the panel.

Lauren (37:08.452)
That's a lucky dog.

Lauren (37:16.702)
Lauren (37:27.745)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (37:31.938)
And he loves it. And he had cardiac heart failure. You know, he had heart failure, you know, two and a half years ago. And he's he hangin'. You know? He's hanging. He's hangin'. So I just you know, I I there's there's there's this I always go back to the idea that the animal does not have a placebo. They do not care if it works or it doesn't work.

Lauren (37:40.26)
Sweet things. Sweet, sweet.

Lauren (37:53.327)
They also don't know why. So I in some ways I take back my argument, like we have to know why. Like we can trust our intuition. I think as logical, thinking, conscious beings, it's good to know why because the behavior will probably change, more likely to change if you know why. but animals don't know why. They just intuitively do what feels right to their bodies, and it's quite simple. They it's impossible for them to overcomplicate, and that's a really beautiful ideal. Like, I want more of that.

Freddie Kimmel (38:08.846)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (38:21.837)
Yeah. I'm really the other thing that's coming up for me right now, I've been doing a lot of research around total plasma exchange, which is a therapy. It's so funny, a a kid from a kid, he was a man at the time from my college had passed away. He had HIV, he ran a marathon, he picked up this really obscure infection, and he was septic in the hospital and TPE

Lauren (38:49.358)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (38:50.796)
This is like two thousand fifteen. They're like, you know, they had they had we have this treatment in Europe, infuresis. We're gonna it was a long shot, right? They had had to go get this machine from another hospital down in Brooklyn. He ended up passing away. But that was my first experience with this. And now right right now it's like the internet's like full of people holding up their bags of plasma that, you know, the the Paul Saladinos of the world, I love Paul, he's like, Hey, I've removed twenty five years of toxins from my blood.

Lauren (39:12.164)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (39:20.224)
Which is sort of true. And the physiology is such that, you know, our toxins are essentially they the the body doesn't want them in the blood. It wants to park them in the fat and your bones. It wants to get them out of the way or it's gonna do damage to your heart. So it is true that you're gonna remove large amounts of toxicity with TPE, total plasma exchange, or infuresis, which is now another one they're talking about, a European machine that's a little little more nuanced. and we will keep going into that on the podcast.

Lauren (39:22.116)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (39:48.395)
But I've been amazed at people dropping ten, twelve thousand dollars here in Austin, Texas at weighs too well. You know, per treatment. And the advice of this clinic is like you need you need five or eight. So people are flying in here, they're doing they're doing total plasma exchange, twelve thousand dollars a pop, ten thousand dollars a pop, and they're doing them like in succession. Like I'm gonna come to Austin to do a bunch. You need time for the body to regenerate all those vital

Lauren (39:54.764)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (40:15.203)
nutrients and the cell membrane that are going to be beneficial for life. Yeah. It's wild.

Lauren (40:21.07)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And the body's naturally intelligent, right? We weren't given a broken machine. I think plasma exchange is an an amazing tool, especially if you're dealing with a deadly infection. Does the average person need that? Or are we looking for a quick fix? Are we looking for that thing where you can just throw down some money and suddenly be better? But you're not fixing the terrain. You're not fixing the program by doing TPE, right? You're gonna be living in a s

Freddie Kimmel (40:44.478)
Yeah. Yeah. Wait, did your air condition did your air conditioning come on?

Lauren (40:49.654)
It did, is it loud?

Freddie Kimmel (40:51.58)
I well I couldn't figure out what it was. I was like, wait a second. I was like, is there a garbage truck going by? It was like is that my microphone?

Lauren (40:59.628)
It is just some cool air pumping into the room. Do you want me to I can close it.

Freddie Kimmel (41:02.61)
It's just some cool air it'll probably not be

Yeah, let's do it. Close it. Close that vent. Close that vent. Close that vent.

Lauren (41:09.028)
Let's close it.

Freddie Kimmel (41:13.46)
Well, it's picking up on the mic. I was like, No, no, it's on her side 'cause I just stopped talking for a second.

Lauren (41:17.038)
The mic the mic is working. Give me a second.

Freddie Kimmel (41:23.176)
I love it. Well well Lauren goes away and tends to her air conditioning. I'm gonna keep the thread going here. my god, that's so much better. It was a garbage truck, I thought the Roomba. That's I I thought it I thought it could have been a Roomba. It's great.

Lauren (41:30.884)
Not a garbage truck going by.

Yeah, a r a room is not working. Yeah. Is that better? Okay, no moving air is good for a podcast.

Freddie Kimmel (41:42.844)
It's phenomenal. just picking up on that s that strain of T PE that you need time to allow the body to recover from that process. And then the other thing that's that's important to know is like eventually, just because of particle size and flow rates, and I'm actually speaking about this tonight at Pep Ten University, you you will the body will start to release. And it's and it's much like

You can diffuse something into water, like put a put a blue flu food dye into water and it'll slowly infuse, or you can stir the glass to move it through quicker. The thing that I've always thought about total plasma exchange is like why couldn't people commit to a full body lymphatic drainage once a week and just start moving that lymphatic fluid and and because because of the mechanical nature of a flow rate?

that as long as we're filtering correctly, that over time the body would be letting go of these things at a much lower price point. And the doctor I had on Paul Savage was like, yes, exactly. Most people don't need TPE. Most people do not need it. Now, if you've had a horrible mold exposure or you've been sick with twenty years with chronic bacterial infections and your body's not clearing senescent cells and you feel like death, it's a it's an amazing treatment. yeah.

Lauren (43:03.352)
Sure. But I would say and still you need to work on your terrain and you need to work on your thoughts and you need to work on overall lifestyle because you can't buy your way out of a a body that doesn't trust itself and feel safe and is optimized to do what it's naturally designed to do, which is to move lymph, detox, regenerate. The body does that. So both sick populations and healthy populations seeking that treatment still need that. Both.

Freddie Kimmel (43:24.111)
Yeah. Yeah it's

Freddie Kimmel (43:30.489)
Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah, you can't skip what's on the end of the fork and the water and the sleep hygiene and the movement and the mechanics and you can't skip it. meeting people where they're at in a time of suffering, we have some amazing stuff available to us today that was not available to us five years ago, was not available to us, you know, twenty years ago, not even a fraction of what we have the the access to. I did I did find it fascinating

Lauren (43:42.894)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (43:57.729)
Dr. Paul saying that they're tracking people four years out and saying even after three to four treatments that they will they have not had anyone need the treatment again, that there was enough of a cascade and flow that when they stack that therapy with an avoidance therapy, water filters, water filtration, washing your vegetables, unawareness around microplastics, what are we buying for the home, that they did not need additional treatments.

That the deburdening was like it worked, like it continues to work. So that's his experience, his that is they're they're tracking they're tracking people who've done the TPE. They done they do about a hundred people a month, and I think they have over twelve clinics now in the US. It needs more study and it needs more science, but it I'm very interested in it. Have you ever done anything like that?

Lauren (44:28.516)
Mm.

Lauren (44:46.794)
No, but I am doing Eboo next week, more as an experiment that I can speak to, not because I think I necessarily need it, but per someone that came on my podcast was offered, so I'm gonna go experience it and talk about it.

Freddie Kimmel (45:03.427)
Where are you gonna go to Eboo?

Lauren (45:05.614)
The longevity center in Greenville, South Carolina.

Freddie Kimmel (45:09.177)
Greenville, South Carolina. Amazing. Amazing. Who is it?

Lauren (45:11.705)
Yeah.

So we didn't have the physician on the podcast. So I don't know the guy's name that runs it, but I'm gonna I'm gonna find that out and tell you later. yeah, I think these strategies are amazing what I tell the average person to do it, but I do think it's a responsibility of us as educators and people that have platforms to know about these things and be able to speak to them and know when they're appropriate for certain people. But that makes sense to me that they are seeing that maintenance down the road.

Freddie Kimmel (45:19.43)
got it.

Lauren (45:44.14)
And I we put this in a detox category, correct? TPE, largely a type of detox. and I think that would go with any kind of detox strategy if you lower the burden and you maintain, i.e., like stop an an influx of toxins, plasticizers coming into your body, that it your body would maintain that. You're teaching your body to be at a different level. The problem is a lot of people do these detox strategies and they go back to their life as they knew it before.

Freddie Kimmel (45:47.639)
Yeah. Yep.

Lauren (46:14.156)
And then they do have to keep spending money on the thing. It's like there's so many instances of this. It's like, okay, a GLP one, it's gonna help you short term, but are you intervening and changing the behaviors while you're on that so your body can maintain that going forward? Perhaps same with hormones. I mean, we could apply that to so many different things.

Freddie Kimmel (46:14.542)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (46:30.742)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (46:35.403)
Yeah. What's your understanding of Iboo? Do you know much about it?

Lauren (46:41.442)
Mm, not to the level that I could educate your audience on it.

Freddie Kimmel (46:45.077)
No, that's that's okay. We've not really had a conversation around EBU. It's it's you know, y what we're doing is we're ozonating and filtering the blood. And we're basically putting the blood I'm gonna really, real basic, it's kind of putting the blood through a HEPA filter. A as we oxygenate and then we put this purified, very I d you know, because basically when when when ozone hits a molecule or any biological material, that unstable third molecule of oxygen

Neutralizes a virus, a pathogen, a spike protein, and at the same time it oxygenates the blood. So I believe an EBU machine is both cleaning and oxygenating. So basically, much like TPE, you have a needle in one vein, it's going through a machine, and then they're putting the blood back in, the clean, filtered, purified blood back in the other vein. Yeah. Yeah. It's really cool. I've never done it.

Lauren (47:32.612)
Mm.

Lauren (47:37.366)
What does TPE look like? Because I have this image of Eboo in one, you see it, it goes back in the other. I don't know the visual of TPE.

Freddie Kimmel (47:45.425)
lo looks the same except there's this third filter in which like all this old plasma and the the discarded biological material is collecting and that's why you see the people holding up this yellow bag. But the the machines they could be, you know, cousin machines. They're in the same world. I have done that and it failed really. I had a horrible experience where the whatever at the no doing TPE the the

Lauren (48:01.688)
Yeah.

Lauren (48:08.142)
Doing Eboo.

Freddie Kimmel (48:13.416)
the machine kept stalling. It it didn't have enough suction. So first of all, the needles are like eighteen gauge and it you we were numbing the area just to get the needle in is a huge needle. Needle failed one time, had to put a needle in again. Then the machine would lose its suction for whatever reason, whether whether there wasn't the right mixing agents in the blood or heparn or or s I think it's it I forgot what Dr. Paul said he added.

He they add some type of anticoagulant to the blood to keep it moving through the machine, but mine did not work. I mean I was on there, it I'm the machine quit twenty two times in a three hour session. And I got like I probably got like you know, I got like half the bag full and I was like, I'm good I'm good guys. I'm I'm I'm we're let's let's call this.

Lauren (49:03.286)
Was that just a blip, a technological failure, but you still believe in it, you're gonna go do it again? That was like just an error that day.

Freddie Kimmel (49:09.372)
Yeah, this is like three years ago, yeah. It just didn't work. It didn't work. I and I don't I c I can't tell you why. I don't know why, but it was painful and it was arduous and Yeah. I do want to try it again, just with my history of Lyme and all the things and and and you know there's some again, there is little fringe research around it for s d all the different circulated cancer markers and everything. And actually

Lauren (49:13.006)
Interesting.

Lauren (49:20.993)
Ooh, the needle.

Freddie Kimmel (49:38.599)
The content from from those episodes has been flagged by community comments on Instagram saying, you know, while TPE is a viable medical treatment, the reasons people are using it for and claiming in this episode are highly controversial. Like so it's been flagged in community notes. Which makes me think it's real good.

Lauren (50:06.126)
was gonna say no comment. No comment because there's a lot of really good things that we're not allowed to talk about and and that's just the state of the world.

Freddie Kimmel (50:08.626)
Ha ha

Freddie Kimmel (50:15.462)
I know. Well I'm in Instagram jail for a whole year for for talking about Quicksilver Scientific. They said I was selling drugs and

Lauren (50:22.114)
Well, congratulations. You were you were doing great things. All the great ones get banned. Yeah. I was

Freddie Kimmel (50:25.916)
I was doing great things. I was doing great things. All the great ones get banned. All the great ones. Are let me ask you this, just 'cause it's a hot topic, are there any how's your how's your peptide life? Any peptides you're experimenting with? 'Cause I know that's a fun thing to talk about.

Lauren (50:41.036)
I I'm a little over the needles at the moment, to be honest. I'm taking a tiny break. I was experimenting slash using I I've done a couple of rounds of the glow blend, which is BBC T V G H K C U. Great the copper G H K C U is great for skin regeneration, hair, tissue healing. I've been doing a lot of things to my face. I told you I had a laser on my face, so I was in the past

Freddie Kimmel (50:43.835)
Okay.

Freddie Kimmel (50:56.316)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (51:08.09)
I can't tell, you look great.

Lauren (51:10.892)
Well, a little bit of concealer. But I did a moxie laser, which is basically like a fractionated non ablative laser. I have sunspots, I'm I'm prone to them. There is a genetic component, but I am predisposed to collecting more melanin in certain spots of my skin and as I age they sort of get darker. My dad has them, my grandmother had them. I'm like, my skin. so I'm been going through this laser series and to help my my skin to heal, because basically you're creating like controlled damage and injury so that the skin can go in and go, okay.

Freddie Kimmel (51:24.87)
Mm.

Lauren (51:40.758)
Okay, let's start over. We'll reset repair in a healthy, controlled way. so I've used a lot of copper through peptides to help that healing process. I love that peptide. So, and that combination of BPC, TV, a lot of wear and tear to my body from performing and dancing and doing sort of unnatural things eight shows a week. That's been super helpful to me. I am about to do a round of KISPepin. Are you familiar with KISS Pepti?

Freddie Kimmel (52:07.302)
No, tell us, educate us.

Lauren (52:09.302)
Yeah, it falls into the hormone category. It's an ovarian signaling molecule. And I'm sort of at the tipping point of perimetopause. I I think I'm in it. And I think that's always the big question. Am I in it? We don't know. It's like impossible to diagnostically say that you're in it because biomarkers kind of go crazy. A lot of the diagnoses are based off of symptoms, but I have noticed a slight change in my menstrual cycle length. I've been tracking it for 20 years, so I'm like very tuned into any tiny little

different. So I'm like, okay, I think I'm I have stepped into this phase of time. so I'm I'm gonna try CISPepin, which is going to optimize the ovarian signaling, just to see if it creates like a little more

What's word I'm searching for? A little more ease on this path, make it a little less bumpy, because we know the perimetopausal journey is like a roller coaster. So that's next up on the list. What else have I tried? What what are you trying? I I'm I'm blanking.

Freddie Kimmel (53:09.291)
I mean I do a low dose I do I do I do a low dose retitrutide, which is illegal.

Lauren (53:17.152)
I've done some reta. I've done microdoses of reta. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (53:20.993)
I do read it. I find that like I'm gonna bastardize my dose, but it's twenty ticks on the insulin syringe. No, it's like ten ticks on the insulin syringe, whatever the milligram bottle I have. I don't know. I find that that keeps the like with my history of like mast cell like Lyme inflammation, it keeps the noise real low and I just feel really good in my body. I just have a reduction of pain.

Lauren (53:48.068)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (53:49.077)
I am not on a weight loss dose. I do that once a week. That's something that I was on trzepatide, but I found with the trzepatide that it was it it slowed down the transit time of my food too much and I would get acid reflux. I hated it. I was like, I could never take this. I could never take this. And I accidentally, for whatever reason, I I had ordered some and they instead of a t a trzepatide, they me a semaglutide.

Lauren (54:05.454)
Hear that a lot.

Freddie Kimmel (54:18.464)
And so for a couple weeks I was doing the semaglutide, which is the GLP one. That was completely stopping my transit time. I mean, I was like, I wouldn't I would have GERD for like three days. I was like, this is terrible. I was like, this is not a good drug. So but the Retta has been great. And I felt really good on it. And I haven't needed to up the dose at all. And I I'm getting the results that I want on a very minimal dose. I'm doing that. And then I just for the first time now

Lauren (54:22.878)
no.

Lauren (54:38.317)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (54:47.605)
I'm doing a higher dose BPC one five seven TB five hundred. it's a thirty milligram bottle, and I'm just doing it like twice a day just because I'm I'm work yep, I'm working out hard in the gym. Hard. And so the my guiding physician has has Sherpa'd me on this, guiding me. I guess I shouldn't use Sherpa. somebody told me Sherpa's not politically correct, that I'm that I'm

Lauren (54:57.06)
twice a day. Well

Okay. Okay.

Lauren (55:13.494)
I don't know the rules.

Freddie Kimmel (55:13.589)
taking that word from a na native people. Anyways, a guide, like you would at Mount Everest. They're guiding me through this experience. So I'm doing this, yeah, I'm doing it in the joints and tendons that are sore, but I'm doing that with this act of isolated stretching and this n I'm opening up these compensatory patterns. So as I'm pushing to my edge and then going for a little bit more, I'm finding the BPC in the TB five hundred. I'm like I'm getting great mobility. Like it's really working. Yeah.

Lauren (55:43.308)
I love that. I've watched you work on your mobility for years and years and years. Sounds like you're like at this perfect little sweet spot. It's tough.

Freddie Kimmel (55:43.327)
Yeah, so obviously

Yep, it's it's getting better. It's getting better. There's things that I can do. I'm I'm in the least amount of pain I've ever been. I can the most mobile I've ever been. I know. I know. Creeping on fifty. So I hope to main I hope to maintain that. And I now I'd I would intuit the other thing though. You know, I've been pretty committed to lymphatic drainage for almost three years because I've had a flow presso in the house. And I I would have to imagine

Lauren (55:58.808)
Buddy, that's amazing. Yeah. Hell yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (56:17.437)
that regular lymphatic drainage is going to help hydrate my fascia. I I I don't know how it wouldn't.

Lauren (56:24.118)
Yeah. Did I tell you that I did a cadaver course?

Freddie Kimmel (56:29.776)
You did tell me, but we didn't talk about it.

Lauren (56:33.368)
This is wild. Can I talk about this? my gosh. This is something I've been wanting to do for 10, 12 years. I remember being in New York and wanting to do it at Mount Sinai. They used to offer this course to, you know, the average person. You didn't have to be in the medical system or schooling system. I didn't jump on it. It went away. I was like, I'm never gonna get to do it. My friend Mary, who we both know, Mary Horn. Sh

Freddie Kimmel (56:33.722)
Amazing. Yeah, let's go.

Freddie Kimmel (57:00.058)
Mm-hmm. Mary was in the wedding.

Lauren (57:02.766)
Mary was in the wedding, she texted me and she said, Hey, I'm going to Boulder for this course. Do you wanna come just hang out with me? We can have girl time when when I'm not in the course And I was like

Of course, I'm going to ask you what course you're doing. And she told me, and I signed up like an hour later. It was a cadaver course for yoga practitioners. I am not a yoga teacher, but I have always wanted to do this. And I said, hell yes, I'm going. It was a four-day course in a cadaver lab where we got two cadavers, two humans that donated their bodies to science so that we could learn. And really interesting presentation. There is no control over what bodies they get. You know, they pull back the

Freddie Kimmel (57:33.149)
Wow.

Lauren (57:42.476)
Tarp and you get what you get. We had two women that we didn't know at the time, but we found out later were the exact same age, completely different expressions of physical health. One strong bones, strong, big, like juicy red muscles, and everything is preserved. It wasn't

They didn't use formaldehyde, it was frozen. So the tissue is the colors that you would expect them to be in a living body. the other, also 70, small, almost every bone in her body was broken, zero muscle tissue, so much subcutaneous fat, completely different expressions of life. Now we don't know anything about their lifestyle, but we could start to make assumptions and sort of tell a story about how we think they live their lives, right?

Most likely. I mean there's so many We can make so many assumptions we could put an avatar profile on either of them, but it was very clear to me that the the smaller

Freddie Kimmel (58:30.678)
One was a yoga teacher, one was a cross center.

Freddie Kimmel (58:36.772)
I'm sorry, that was rude. Yep. Yeah.

Lauren (58:48.386)
Woman with the broken bones and very little muscle tissue probably had very low hydration, didn't move her body, so her fascia was very adhesive, very sticky. You couldn't peel it back, very little muscle tissue, obviously very low bone density. And I just remember thinking over and over like my

God, our fascia is so important. Like hydrating and moving our body. I was like, if I do nothing else for the rest of my life, I'm gonna hydrate and I'm gonna I'm gonna move my fascia. That is it. Because I saw what happened in this woman's poor, sweet body. And maybe she was healthy and happy until the day that she lived, but her physical body surely did not express that. It was really interesting. They were both seventy.

Freddie Kimmel (59:25.222)
How old how old were they?

Seventy. That's young.

Lauren (59:31.072)
I know. I know. Yeah, and we don't know why they died. They said natural causes, but one had a colostomy bag. I think she's had some sort of stomach cancer. I'm not sure how that's qualified as dying of natural causes, but I I I think she probably was sick and maybe stopped eating and so that's why. the other one I don't I don't know. Probably very little life force and also stopped eating, I'm imagining. But

Freddie Kimmel (59:33.388)
That's young. Ugh.

Freddie Kimmel (59:43.226)
Yeah.

Lauren (59:56.92)
Just to come back to the fascia, I'm like, that is really frickin' important.

Freddie Kimmel (01:00:00.036)
Can you tell us about the fascia? Like what did it look like when you got to peel it back? How thick is it? Can you describe it? Is there a certain texture that it had?

Lauren (01:00:10.716)
It looks like a spider web, but it's kind of a gel like. It's it's shiny and it's wet. you should be able to peel it back quite easily. Like think of like a piece of plastic wrap. You should be able to just go like sh and peel it off. And when it's dehydrated or adhesed, adhesed either from dehydration, lack of

Freddie Kimmel (01:00:29.348)
Uh-huh.

Lauren (01:00:35.606)
movement or perhaps a surgery. So this woman had a lot of scars, so she had scarred tissue and therefore fascia that was adhesed. It just doesn't move. You can't pull it back in sheets. You have to like

really kind of cut it and it just gets like clumpy and ch and chunky. It should be these big, beautiful webs and sheets. The fascia is basically like the encasing of all the it's encasing for the whole body. It holds our organs, it holds our muscles. It's everywhere. It's literally everywhere in the body, in the brain. and hers was just like it was icky to I I can't think of a better word. It was icky. Clumpy, didn't move.

Freddie Kimmel (01:01:13.945)
Yeah.

Lauren (01:01:17.644)
And lack of movement we know is actually death, right? Like we if we are moving, we are living, we are breathing. And there was lack of movement and activity, which I just thought was fascinating.

Freddie Kimmel (01:01:28.312)
Football is life, movement is life, yeah. Yeah.

Lauren (01:01:30.774)
It is, it is. So I don't know. I whatever that means to you, I'm like hydrate and move your body. And I think lymphatic health plays a big role in that. I think you know, it could be foam rolling, which is maybe our most direct way to interact with our fascia, but just moving your body is gonna move your fascia.

Freddie Kimmel (01:01:46.888)
Yeah. I I'm I b I believe in soft tissue work. I believe in rolling. I I have gotten into this habit of I've been playing with I've been printing with rolling up a towel, taking a a bath towel, folding it in half, folding it in half again, and then rolling it so it becomes a roller.

And then I can go all the way, I can do the whole towel, or I can do I can unroll it and do a smaller piece. And I've been playing at the end of the day, I put on Vibe music and I lay in the the recovery lounge and I lay on I I do my stomach, like where I've had all my surgery, I do over my over my liver and then the other side of the rib cage. I do under my armpits. But I'll do like two to three minutes of letting it sit against my fascia and breathing.

Lauren (01:02:41.932)
Mm.

Freddie Kimmel (01:02:42.152)
I find way better mobility doing that than I do ever have a foam roller. I mean, I get great releases. I get calm. I can feel my rib cage start to move and mobilize as like a big collective unit. It's great. I've actually been thinking about I'm like, I should do a video on this because it's so I do the outside of my my hip flexors on the outside get really tight. Do you ever have you ever do you know I notice this in the airport? You notice how peop I watch people walk all the time? I'm always like

Amazed how people waddle and it the older you get, the more you there's no swivel in the pelvis anymore. It's like it's like a

Lauren (01:03:17.676)
Or people that walk and don't their arms don't move, like their trunk is just fixated. yeah. I I'm obsessed with wa watching people.

Freddie Kimmel (01:03:22.901)
Yeah, it's like a toy soldier. I really notice that I really notice that in the airport, especially older individuals. I'm like, you're like to the toy soldier phase. I d I and I wonder and and I just don't know about the physiology of of fascia enough, is that is it recoverable? Can you rehydrate it? Is it so adhesed and dried out that it is like this suit, like dampening down your movement ability?

Lauren (01:03:52.036)
I don't think anything's permanent.

Freddie Kimmel (01:03:54.142)
Yeah.

Lauren (01:03:55.64)
But it is a cascade of events where if it's restricting movement then you're less likely to move it because it doesn't feel good or it's difficult. You know? Like a lot of people, they get injured and they don't move.

Maybe because someone told them to rest. We're now we're sort of like debunking that. It's like, no, maybe rest isn't you don't want to rest for too long. You gotta move it. You gotta reintegrate it. but a lot of people don't move because they're in pain, and that's creating further dysfunction rather than working with it or working around it or listening to it or just breathing into it, like you said, with the towel versus a foam roller is quite intense. It can be too aggressive for a lot of people. And if it feels intense, then your nervous system is probably receiving it as intense and it's probably gonna lock up and not breathe and not receive the benefits of.

So it's almost this other layer of like, is foam rolling good or bad? Well, there's no good or bad. It's how you use it. How does your body need it? And for some people, a towel is exactly what they need. For some people they need the hard black one with the the knobs and the you know, they need to like get in there. I don't think most fashion needs aggressive touch, but

Freddie Kimmel (01:04:39.666)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:04:54.886)
It's the

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but I find a re like long holds were what really helped my abdominal adhesions. It was always over a minute. If I wasn't gonna hold the tension point at a minute and a half, I then I'm just pulling stuff around because it's attached and I don't know what's happening in my intestine, but I found with long, long two minute holds laying on a ball that I would it would go go go go go gook and I would feel it open up and I'm like, What was that? And I get those

Lauren (01:05:05.784)
Yeah, I believe that.

Lauren (01:05:23.876)
Mhm. Yeah, most your body needs time. Same with stretching. People don't hold stretches long enough. Like Paul Chek says you need to hold a stretch for like two minutes. We hold it like fifteen seconds. We're like, Are done? Okay, moving on.

Freddie Kimmel (01:05:34.267)
Yeah, yeah. Or yeah, or like a breath. A breath. Yeah, and there's lots of you know, there's again, that's a great area of where there's lots of polarizing opinions. Like, you know, the functional pattern guys, probably the most polarizing people on the internet, they're like, Does a lion scratch? No. No, it doesn't. It d I'm like, Well, lions get old and then they die 'cause they can't hunt anymore, so can we can I think past that biological intervention and can I

The thing, Lauren, the the math that doesn't math to me is like when I look at an ultrasound and I look at like a percussion massage gun going g like that doesn't seem to me like it would be good for the fascia. It seems like couldn't I create adhesions? Whereas like s holding down the the muscle and tacking it down, like with a tack band or like the the mobility bands where you wrap around your leg and then you go through a lunge, wouldn't that help

Gliding better than than a foam roller?

Lauren (01:06:35.672)
I think all can be use all can be useful. All can be useful. But I I'm not a fan of the percussive massage guns. I think I think they've done studies where it doesn't actually change the tissue. Like I like the rapid release because it's vibration. It's actually like releasing the fascia. But I mean, in terms of mobility, like we think mobility is just like doing an arm circle, but you actually have to use strength and activate that joint to create space in the joint capsule. So

Freddie Kimmel (01:06:35.908)
Like act it

Yeah.

Lauren (01:07:04.416)
I think a lot of our understanding of what mo creating mobility is actually quite flawed. people aren't doing it long enough or they're not using strength, they're not activating, or they're just not using the right time, pressure, and frequency for their physiology. There's so many nuances to that.

Freddie Kimmel (01:07:19.256)
Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. We could we could have done a whole podcast about the bodies and fascia.

Lauren (01:07:27.37)
Yeah, I'm pretty obsessed with it. I'm pretty obsessed with it. But I'm like, you know, whether you want a foam roll or not, do you know it's good or not? I just start by drinking good water. Probably drink more water. I don't like that probably would have done that woman that I worked on quite a service. I I don't think that she saw the sun. I don't think that she stood up out of a chair very often and I don't think she had hydration.

Freddie Kimmel (01:07:37.722)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:07:44.943)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:07:53.805)
Yeah. Well, listen, I think we should close it down because we're over an hour. I said this was gonna be thirty minutes. I want to thank you for your time. Appreciate your knowledge and insight and expertise as always. It's such a treat. Where can people find more of you, Lauren Santaro? Lauren Woodard, Lauren Woodard

Lauren (01:08:01.22)
Thank you for having me.

Lauren (01:08:09.592)
I hang out on Instagram. Well, no you know on all on all the website social media, I'm still Sambatero. I will keep that name. So Lauren underscore Sambatero on Instagram. My website is LaurenSambotero.com and podcast is biohuggerbeats. Yeah, if you look for Woodard, you won't find her. She not there. Thank you.

Freddie Kimmel (01:08:19.693)
Okay.

Freddie Kimmel (01:08:29.56)
She ain't there. You will not find her. And you and your sister do such a great podcast. You're my go to. It's I I I find everything is so agenda driven that you guys just have real nice, honest conversations. You both worked enough time and in the clinical setting where you're working with people, you're not just you're not influencing health every week on a new show. Yeah, you're actually seeing where it falls apart. I I very much respect you.

Lauren (01:08:51.192)
Hypothesizing.

Freddie Kimmel (01:08:56.972)
I will give people if you want some shows that the babes have done that are excellent, the one on plastic surgery and fillers. I I listened to that while I was in Italy. I was I was working out in a gym and it was I couldn't couldn't stop. I thought it was gold about the awareness around the long term damage of fillers, some of the radio frequency devices that are probably from the science creating more damage, possibly long term than good.

And I think about how quick we are to do things to our face to to change our appearance so quickly without knowing the long term repercussions. Who was that? That was a great interview.

Lauren (01:09:34.542)
Doctor Cameron Chestnut. He lives in Washington. Like he's like almost off the grid, but he does he's like a true biohacker. He really looks at the whole individual and wants to actually create longevity. But he's also real. He's like he's really rounded in reality. But Cameron Chestnut, really cool.

Freddie Kimmel (01:09:53.782)
Cameron Chestnut, excellent. I want to get him on. I want to talk to you about that. The episode with Dr. J. Wiles about resonant breathing and the limitations of many of the vagal stimulation devices on the market. And that one was so good. And then is it Brittany, the woman that you just had about perimetopause?

Lauren (01:10:08.61)
That one too.

Lauren (01:10:15.062)
Bria, Bria Gad. Yeah. Yeah, we love her. She's a fellow FDN, so we had similar training and she's awesome. She's also just like a real chick. Like she's in it. She's on this journey too. And yeah, so if you're a female struggling with hormonal stuff and yeah, needs some direction, she's great gal.

Freddie Kimmel (01:10:16.822)
Bria God, excellent episode.

Freddie Kimmel (01:10:37.376)
Yeah, so good. And we'll leave it at that for now. But go check out the podcast. It's so good. It's just yeah, it's just real easy listening and I get a I get a lot of value. I get a lot of inspiration from your guys' show at where to go next and where to take this platform next. So thank you for your work.

Lauren (01:10:54.862)
Thank you for saying that. We were inspired by you. I you were the reason we started our podcast. I remember sitting in Central Park in those dinky little metal chairs. I was like, tell me, what kind of microphone? Am I crazy for doing this? Where do I get started? So, Freddie Kimmel, you are the reason why we have the biohacker baits.

Freddie Kimmel (01:11:10.902)
Well I love it. I love it. And we're both in the three hundred club.

Lauren (01:11:14.69)
Yes we are. I love that. It's pretty cool. It's a fun journey.

Freddie Kimmel (01:11:17.386)
It's wild. That's wild. Well, I will no doubt talk to you again. Can't wait to to have you on. Anytime you want to come on, you have an open invitation. You, your sister, and your dad, biohacking legacy. I should mention the Julian Dental Center up in Maryland is probably one of the best dental centers in the United States. If you guys are looking for biological dentistry, that's another good visit. And your dad's what's your dad's social account? Just so people can have that one.

Lauren (01:11:36.676)
Mm-hmm.

Lauren (01:11:44.12)
Doctor Gene Sambotero. So same last name. Yeah. He has an attached wellness center, so you go and get your surgery if you're getting root canals repaired or

Freddie Kimmel (01:11:48.242)
Yep. Excellent. At Dental Center and Longevity Clinic.

Lauren (01:11:59.598)
repairing from infection or dealing with airway stuff. You have all the regenerative stuff to support your healing journey, including two flow pressos main event there at the Novum Wellness Center. hyperbaric, P EMF, red light, all kinds of cool stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks, friend. Love you.

Freddie Kimmel (01:12:16.01)
So awesome. So awesome. We will talk soon. Big love. Love you.