From SWAT Raids to Peptide Healer: Samantha Lander on Addiction, Recovery & Biohacking Your Way Back to Health

WELCOME TO EPISODE 284

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Freddie Kimmel (00:01.44)
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the beautifully broken podcast. We're back today with Sam Lander. Welcome to the show, Sam.

Samantha Lander (00:08.837)
Hello, thanks for having me.

Freddie Kimmel (00:11.458)
Thanks for being with us this morning. Because we did this off the cuff and we've chatted for a little bit, we're gonna talk about a lot of cool stuff today, but we're talking kind of our morning prep for podcasts or when you gotta be on. Is there something you'd love to do before you're on air?

Samantha Lander (00:29.243)
I do. do. Well, I was just telling you that I like to do, there's this little bumper thing that you can get. I'm trying to get it. That's what I was complaining about that has MOTC, NAD, methane blue, um, corianthium in it. And you can just take a little bump of it. You know, I'm an addict, so it's fun to like be able to do it legally. And, um, it is like, it's a firecracker for when you have a podcast, podcast, but today I don't have any. I did just the NAD nasal spray. I did some C-max, a teeny bit of

pesto fencing and that's it. And my goat milk and coffee and brisket are ready to go. Ready to go.

Freddie Kimmel (01:05.483)
Yeah, you're ready to go. You're ready to go. Well, it's very different than a standard breakfast or a waking stack of your average American. And we're going to talk about that a little bit today. It's so funny. I find when I record before noon, if I get up and I slept good and just like a little red light, little journaling, little breath work, I'm pretty good. And then I love just a black cup of clean coffee.

Samantha Lander (01:15.195)
I'm

Freddie Kimmel (01:34.326)
And I'm pretty good.

Samantha Lander (01:34.905)
You know what I'll say to that black coffee? It burns out your hydrochloric acid in your gut. So put some sort of fat in there. You can put like little like coconut oil in there, like a little blob. Tiny bit.

Freddie Kimmel (01:37.506)
What will you say?

Hahaha

Put some-

Freddie Kimmel (01:47.703)
Yeah, viable. Well, we'll get to test that, because we're going to run some tests and do some stuff like that, which is fun. I wanted to kick us off. So the beautifully broken podcast, the times when life knocks us down a little bit, has there ever been a time in your life where you felt life knocked you down?

Samantha Lander (01:52.379)
Yeah, everyone.

Samantha Lander (02:07.555)
Never, dude, never. I'm like, I'm a unicorn. No, yes, I've had many times. I feel like I've had, I always call them my streams. I feel like right now, because all my streams are turning into one big river, which is really cool. So I have, you know, my addiction story where, you know, I became really fully addicted to lots of drugs and was, you know, had SWAT raids and prison and all the things.

rehab. And then I have my biological like dentistry overhaul story. I have my fertility story. I have my health journey. And I feel like these are all the things that have really knocked me down. A lot of them are health related, you know, when you look at the big picture, but then now they're all sort of just flowing into this really big river, which is really cool where I'm able to bring my work and my addiction together, which is the bomb, like a dream.

Freddie Kimmel (03:02.606)
Do you have a definition for addiction when you use the word?

Samantha Lander (03:09.376)
So, that's good. So for addiction, I think it's the inability to say no to something that you know could be potentially harmful to you and the, you know, where, where it's overabundance where one is too many and a thousand is never enough. So if you want one, you're always going to want 10 more or 20 more and you can't stop.

So to me, that's sort of what I see as addiction. think it. You know, you could have like a little bit of an ism sometimes I'll say, you know, and then you can have like a lot of an ism. So it's interesting to kind of see. But that's what I would say is, is that where you can't control the desire to partake in something that it could be good things, I guess.

Freddie Kimmel (03:58.583)
Yeah, because my belief is that as human beings we're all to some degree addicts. That we, yeah, you know, it's like if there's a lot of things that I do in my life that people would say that's absolutely ridiculous that you do that, but because I have a belief system that it's good for my energy, my health, and my well-being, I'm like, I am literally addicted to it.

Samantha Lander (04:06.779)
All right.

Samantha Lander (04:23.747)
Yeah, for sure. For sure. think that, you know, what, what I, so I had 13, you know, 13 years sober. So I was addicted to all the drugs and things and 13 years sober and I relapsed on alcohol. And that was the first time when I realized that, that addiction is really a disease. So I never really believed it because I think that the first time I got sober, I, I either was scared or I hit my bottom.

And I was done. was emotionally bankrupt. I wasn't like broke. I wasn't living in a car. I wasn't shooting a heroin, which I thought was what the definition of being a drug addict was. So I couldn't identify with what that meaning was at that point. But I was able to stop when I was ready to be done. I became so emotionally bankrupt and I was so empty that I hit a point where I was like sick and tired of being sick and tired. And I did something about it.

And so that's kind of how the first time went. But the second time I was drinking, I couldn't stop. Like I physically could not stop every day at four o'clock. I would go buy a bottle of gin and I would drink that entire bottle of gin until I pretty much went to bed. Like I just, I'd be blacked out. Like I couldn't, I couldn't stop. And every morning I would pray to God and pray and go to meetings and do everything I could to just try to give it up to my release system to just stop.

And I mean, I couldn't, it was like every day, like I'm not going to do it. just got to get, I just got to get 24 hours. And then once I get 24 hours, I'll get 48 hours and I couldn't do it. And I don't know if it was like physical detox that was starting at four o'clock because it was like a physical craving until like I did eventually one time stop. And then I was like, I felt like I had the flu for like three days, but I thought detox was like shaking and like, you know, you'd be like all over the place. And it wasn't like my body wasn't physically doing what

but what we would like to define as detoxing or in my mind.

Freddie Kimmel (06:23.116)
Yeah. When you think about this idea that the environment informs biology, what do you think in your environment when you were a young kid set you off on that first road to an experience with drugs, alcohol, addiction?

Samantha Lander (06:43.173)
So my first drink was in seventh grade and very, like I was trying to, I know that I was always trying to like find something to not feel whatever it was I was feeling, right? And I think at that point, the trauma that I was going through was a little bit of, you know, anxious attachment and anxiety with my family.

but my family, look really good on paper. So you wouldn't identify that. Like it's like, think sometimes it's worse when it's not so aggressive where your parents an alcoholic, you were molested, like all the things it's like very, it's like a gentle bit of like emotional dysfunction. So I think it's a combination of that. I was definitely diagnosed with ADHD and all the things I never took the medication. I was very anti that. And I think I also was very sick.

So in fifth grade, I started getting chronic stomach, stomach aches, like horrific, lots of inflammation and like chronic fatigue. So that started in fifth grade. And I think that I, I just didn't want to feel what I was feeling in my body. Like I was just always bloated, always tired and always just like felt sick, always constipated. And I think anything to get out of my head and to bring the crazy thoughts that go live the monkey mind was sort of what I was thinking.

That's what I wanted.

Freddie Kimmel (08:03.831)
And how did things progress from that fifth grader with stomach aches and anxiety to somebody that is dealing with some really heavy drugs?

Samantha Lander (08:16.442)
So, you know, I also had this mentality where it was like live life to the fullest and like party hard. Like that's what that meant to me. Like living life was meant party. And I don't know why I was always very like the movie, did you ever watch basketball diaries with like Leonardo DiCaprio or it's about Jim Carroll, this poet who's like a heroin addict. Like that's the stuff I watched. So I don't know why I was generally like.

intrigued by drugs and alcohol, but something about it definitely intrigued me. And so I think that, you know, there was a little bit of that curiosity. And, you know, I got in trouble almost every time I did something like in eighth grade, I smoked pot for the first time I ended up getting arrested at Six Flags. And so that sort of progressed and it was like a I would do really, really well and then I would like fall apart and

It sort of went in phases. So I think that's why I never thought I had a problem. And in my high school, we all drank a lot. It was very normal to be like heavy drinkers, blackout drinkers, drinking and driving. That was like very normalized where I grew up. So I didn't really see a problem until, well, I didn't see it, but I started to have a real problem when I started using meth and that was junior year of college. And that was a lot at that point, it was a lot of self-medicating and it was like the

I created the perfect cocktail of drugs that worked for me. wasn't drinking, wasn't blocking out. So I think I was just trying to find what worked, you

Freddie Kimmel (09:46.564)
Have you ever, I wanna stay in this line of questioning and I wanna stay with this story right there. Junior year of college, you start experimenting with math. Is there anything in your head that at that time that you're like, am I doing? Like I am about to do, like I've watched, I've watched Maury Povich, I've watched the talk shows, I know what the math heads look like when they come on. Is there any voice that said,

Samantha Lander (10:11.816)
All right.

Freddie Kimmel (10:16.248)
This is bad.

Samantha Lander (10:17.851)
You want to know? No. Well, okay. So the first weekend that I ever tried it, I had been partying and I had done a lot of like Molly and GHB and I don't know if my body was exhausted because you don't really like overdose on that, but I overdose. it was like by the end of a weekend, I overdose. ended up in Cedar cyanide. Um, I was pretty much dead in my friend's car and they were like, okay, what do we do? They're trying to like do CPR and they dragged me in there and I woke up and that's when was like, I'm never doing any of this again. Like,

I thought meth was so horrible, but in California, everything is more glamorous, right? So to me, I just, in my mind, I was like, this is cocaine of the sixties. Like this is totally like clean. It's fancy. I was hanging out with these beautiful gay men. Like they were all my friends. Like there was nothing dirty about it. When I got sober and I moved back to Missouri, totally different perspective on what meth is.

you know, it's, it's definitely a very different demographic. people are blowing themselves up, making it in trailers left and right at that time when I moved home. So my brother was like, I remember my brother was like, that's disgusting. You're a methodic. was like, you are absolutely disgusting. I'm like, what are you talking about? You know, so for me, I just, and I felt so good. I felt, it was self-medicating for ADHD or whatever we want to call it. I felt like my brain was able to.

It's like all the little wires that have always been all over the place going 80,000 directions and me not being able to totally piece things together all suddenly disconnected. And I could read a book, I could write a paper, I could show up for class. I didn't feel tired all the time. I didn't feel puffy. It was like, it was like taking run a true type. Like, I mean, I'm not condoning that, but you know what I mean? It's just like my body felt healthy on it at first.

So I think that's why I loved it.

Freddie Kimmel (12:15.303)
And if you look at the plot line of a Mission Impossible Tom Cruise movie and we get to the apex peak, where do things progress if you could take us from that girl experimenting with math in her junior year to we get to the peak of that narrative arc?

Samantha Lander (12:16.313)
you

Samantha Lander (12:37.883)
All right, so the peak the hero's journey we're doing. So for me, okay, I, some people would say that the peak would be when I had a full swat rate at my house, which was not I think that was just sort of like getting me to realize like there's, there's definitely a problem. You know, I'm an entrepreneur. So for me, I had to pay for my habits. So I got very deep.

Freddie Kimmel (12:40.836)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (13:03.675)
into selling drugs, a lot of drugs, the SWAT raid. And then I think honestly, my pivotal moment when I realized that there was a real, like I was at a bottom was after the SWAT raid, I was looking at 22 to life federal time. I was going into LA County time and I was sitting in my apartment and I said to my dog, I think I need to go to rehab. And she came over and put.

her head on my lap and that was my, that was it. That was like my done. It was like my dog and I sitting in an apartment. I had no friends that would be around me at this point. I was looking at so much prison time. I realized like, just like, it wasn't even that like, I felt like I couldn't stop. Like I think I honestly probably could have, but I just needed a safe place. And I called my parents and I told them I was going to go into treatment. That was my first chapter.

But booze, like the drinking phase was a real bottom. It was way worse.

Freddie Kimmel (14:03.118)
And what it was sticking at this timeline, like what shifted in your story or the unwinding of like your social situation or what shifted to say, this is it, I'm going to rehab. Just the gravity of the situation and all the things that were coming at you.

Samantha Lander (14:05.157)
But that was.

Samantha Lander (14:21.723)
I want you to...

Samantha Lander (14:25.979)
No, I think I went, you know, I went to visit a friend of mine who had a similar journey and he had checked himself into rehab and he's like, come, come visit me. And I'm like, okay, like, you know, here I am. Hi, I go to visit them, but he was so like, it gives me chills thinking about like to his core, his eyes were pretty, they were shining. He was so happy. And all I know is it, looked, and this is my experience in rehab felt like this too. So

It looks like, um, you know, summer camp, looks like the environment was so much structure, you know, summer camp, you get up, they like ring the bell, you all gather around, you might sing a song, you go do a prayer, then you go and you guys all have breakfast together. Then you have your activities throughout the day. And like, this is it's summer camp is what I saw in him. And I was like, I want that. Like, I don't know what it was, but whatever it was, that was like my, that was my spiritual awakening is what I would call it.

And I was so ready at that point to go and I went home and thought about it, kind of asked my dog about it and I was like, I'm going and yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (15:34.722)
And where was he in rehab? What state are you in at this time?

Samantha Lander (15:36.891)
He was in California. I was in California at the time. And so I ended up going to Orange County for a treatment center there. It was great.

Freddie Kimmel (15:51.205)
I have a question and I just out of total ignorance is rehab when you say I'm gonna go to rehab is that something that you pay for is the state pay for that is that a funded program

Samantha Lander (16:02.947)
It depends where you go. So there's independent treatment centers that are can be all out of pocket. Mine was, I think, like $19,000 of it, I remember was covered by insurance and that we might have had to pay a couple thousand. So there was, you should see that there's a movie side note on Netflix about how they, these guys would like, they were like brokering people. So they would go get people to go into treatment, use their insurance, take their money and then get them out. And then like,

like the treatment centers would pay people to do this and then have them relapse and then go back again so they can just keep taking their money. It's this whole movie on it. It's crazy.

Freddie Kimmel (16:42.242)
Is this fiction or non-fiction? Is this documentary? What is it?

Samantha Lander (16:44.707)
No, no, no, this is real. This is a documentary. Yeah, it's like, it's crazy. It's a whole insurance, like rehab scam. But anyway, no, I, there's state funded though, where you can go, you can go into like a hospital and do a detox. If you're coming off alcohol, you need to be like hardcore. You need to be in like a hospital because of seizures and all that stuff.

Freddie Kimmel (16:47.426)
Interesting.

Freddie Kimmel (16:53.582)
And so...

Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (17:06.554)
Yeah, it's so funny. watching, you know, I watch short episodic television at night to wind down my brain like a 30 minute something that kind of the loop is closed. So the story is not continuing to go. And right now I just have like, I'm going back through West Wing, which is just such great writing. It's Alan Sorkin, but the chief of state, there's a big scandal in season one. And the scandal was, is that he was four years before he was in the White House that he was

Checked into a facility for alcohol and Valium and this shows shot, you know the late 90s early 2000s and it was such a big scandal at the show I was like so many people have been in treatment centers for Alka. It's very light, but it's it's so dramatic and so heavy in the show is like my god, these people should come check out 2026

Samantha Lander (17:52.258)
money.

Samantha Lander (17:59.553)
I know, right? It was, it was a very hush-hush. Like for me, I don't know. I never felt like I needed to keep it a secret. I'm a real open book. Like I'm really open with anything. It's a lot. So for me, I never felt like I had to hide my addiction. So I think that's a big thing that a lot of people spend like 10 years, like not telling anybody. And how far it's come today compared to when I got sober, it's incredible. It's just such a movement.

But I always like to talk like my start my talks or whatever I do and I say, okay Can everybody in the room raise their hand? Who's either in recovery or been impacted by something that pertains to drugs and alcohol or addiction and it's usually an entire room will just Everybody stands up and it's super powerful and It's I mean most people have it in their family somehow some way or someone they know a best friend. Yeah

Freddie Kimmel (18:56.303)
every

Samantha Lander (18:56.411)
Sort of a tie that binds us, unfortunately.

Freddie Kimmel (18:59.822)
Yeah, it is a tie that binds. And so you got sober though, and you kicked the really heavy hard drugs. So we're talking all the things, right? Molly, pills, cocaine, meth. What, if any, because again, because we've seen all the reality television, what were the physical impacts and effects on your body at that time of doing those heavy drugs?

Samantha Lander (19:26.811)
So it's funny because if you would have looked at me, I did not look like I was like a tweaker. Like I was like kind of heavy and like, I mean, it's so funny because they were laid it back now, like with all the GLPs it's like, I could eat whatever I wanted. Like for the first time in my life, I wasn't sick. It's kind of, it was interesting, but, so the physical changes, the brain thought, the first one, the first one I was laughing. Like, I don't think I had laughed.

for years. And so that was the biggest thing is like, I remember it was like the summer camp laugh, like I were, you're just belly laughing and you feel like you're going to pee in your pants. And I just remember laughing so much. And then I was like able to physically work out. Like I was really afraid that I wasn't going to be able to work out. And I picked a rehab where we went to go, you know, we had wreck time or whatever. We go to a gym every day because I was an athlete. I was a division, you know, one rower. I, know, a national

synchronized swimming champion, like all these crazy things. But like, I'm an athlete heart, like through and through. And so I was able to work out again. So that was sort of the next thing being like, okay, I'm not totally broken. And then I, you know, got into, there was no sugar at my, it's interesting, the rehab, that was just so perfect for me. Like they didn't allow any sugar. It was like a sugar for your rehab. So that was like something that was ingrained in, in rehab was like no sugar. And so like, I continued that.

So it was just sort of like progressed in different steps. But I think, you know, the more, you know, the brain fog lifts, you get more clarity every month is literally different. It's like you're being reborn. It's like you go in, they say you are the age of when you started, when you stop. So I was what, seventh grade, you know, I mean, I had periods where I stopped, but I just, it's like, you got to grow up. And so that first year, there's a lot of physical changes. You're real emotional.

I made sure that like every decision that I made, just kind of told my parents, like my best decision is my worst at this point. So you're going to make them all, which is a big thing because I'm type a super control freak. So, but I just gave it up. I mean, if you don't give it up, I mean, that's the spiritual part of life is at some point you have to give it up to God or a higher power or whatever it is. I personally believe that or else you're not going to survive it, whether it's cancer or

Freddie Kimmel (21:31.099)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Samantha Lander (21:48.123)
I mean, whatever it is, you have to give it up at some point to something greater than yourself, or it's going to be really hard.

Freddie Kimmel (21:56.294)
Yeah. Yeah, we're, if you think about it that even if you took out, you know, an organized religion piece, it's such, we're such a small little spirit in such a vast universe to say, it's all about me and I'm doing it alone. It's, I don't, there's very, very few egos that can survive that. I'm sure there are, but very, very few. So yeah, I would join with you in that.

Samantha Lander (22:07.898)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (22:16.517)
No.

Samantha Lander (22:20.441)
Well, that's yeah. I mean, that's the 12 steps. Like if you take a look at like, think everybody should do the 12 steps personally, but in a 12 step program, I know some people think it's very culty, whatever. I don't really, I've seen it work so many times and I don't think it, it's just, you practice like these principles and you do these steps. And part of it is like,

You got to have your ego and check, you know, you have a sponsor and that sponsor will tell you very quickly that your ego is getting in the way of everything right now and you're going to relapse or you're going to whatever. So it's like being able to practice humility is a big part of it. And then being able to take an inventory at the end of the day. And these three things I think are really powerful to be able to like at the end of the day, I'm like, okay, was I an asshole to anybody? And then I'll like text him and be like, okay, I'm really, really sorry if I upset you by this, you know, which is cool.

to learn that.

Freddie Kimmel (23:10.971)
Yeah, yeah, it's a great, yeah, I think that just that practice of forgiveness is very, very powerful.

Samantha Lander (23:16.559)
Yeah, well, addicts are unicorns, know. We're better than everyone. You know, we are the best.

Freddie Kimmel (23:22.893)
Yeah, yeah, take us, so you made it 13 years with sobriety and then you had a relapse. So again, I would ask you the same question. What was it in the environment that took that big long chunk of time? And you said, you know what, let's just, let's make a different decision. Let's throw that away.

Samantha Lander (23:42.619)
So my body was broken is how I would say is I was trying to get pregnant. This is where it started is I was trying to get pregnant and it was a really, really challenging. So I had already been through years of trying to heal my body, you know, diagnosed. I found out I had PCOS, like all the things like just years and years of like, and that's how I got into the work that I do now. I got sick of paying for my lab test. So I became an FDN practitioner so I could pay for labs, but

you know, then my body was broken again. And I was in a very challenging marriage. So there was definitely like an emotional piece to it. And that's why I'm so big. I'm like, you have to tap into that or you're never going to get well. And the inability to get pregnant, the inability, the waiting, like you have to wait every month to try again. It just was so hard for someone. And my obsessive compulsive thinking started again.

And it was like just going down rabbit holes on Google, trying to figure out what was wrong with me. What can I do? I need to eat pineapple core doing my, you know, very holistic approach to it. And then having to have like Western medicine say, Nope, I'm sorry. All that shit's bullshit. It's snake oil. We're going to get you a baby. And that's actually what ended up working is I had a really old school doctor. was like, I don't care what you're doing. Like go ahead and take your supplements, but I'll get you a baby my way. And and it's, it did work. And, but, you know,

I also had 32, I was in a marriage with a guy who had like 32 years sober and he started drinking. And that's not even the issue. The issue is like, I didn't stop him. I didn't say, no, this is not okay. This isn't going to work in our marriage. know, I was, they call it like a disease is cunning and baffling. And so for me, I feel like the disease was coming out and it basically, I was ready to drink again because I was dealing with all that infertility stuff. I just couldn't drink because I ended up getting pregnant.

And so I was sort of like, I feel like I was banking his drinks. So like every time you drink or smoke weed, was like, okay, that's one more for me. You know, I cannot wait to have this baby and we're going to drink together. It's going to be so much fun. You know, I'm going to do this and drinking was never my thing. So I felt like, okay, it's going to be okay. I know better.

Freddie Kimmel (25:40.955)
Hmm.

Samantha Lander (25:54.839)
And once I had my baby between like postpartum, I'm not very maternal. Like if you know me, I love to work like super entrepreneur. I thrive off work. That's my driving force and everything else goes really well. And just, just a tough marriage. I definitely fell into like the mommy wine culture and listening to my clients. I was personal training at the time. And so it's like the glamorization of wine and like all of it. Just, I just was like, fuck it.

And so, yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (26:24.655)
Yeah. Do you, this is such a side journey. Do you watch, you don't watch Shrinking on Apple, do you? I love the show and I love Ted Lazo. I, I'm trying to say, is it a judgment? But I'm always interested how it's never a focal point per se of the show's script, but.

Samantha Lander (26:32.621)
I do. I do.

Right.

Freddie Kimmel (26:50.383)
They're always, like, somebody always has a glass of wine or a beer. It's very layered in there. Do you notice that or no?

Samantha Lander (26:58.703)
I didn't notice. That's funny. I didn't notice, but there are certain shows where I'll notice that the wine thing, like it's very like, you'll see it a lot. That's interesting. I'm going to pay attention. neighbor, the neighbor, does the neighbor mom always have a glass of wine? I feel like she does in that show. His neighbor.

Freddie Kimmel (27:00.046)
Yeah, I do.

Freddie Kimmel (27:11.545)
Yeah, I'm fine with it, but I was-

Freddie Kimmel (27:19.793)
I mean, they do. There's just lots of times when they're out and there's like always the undercurrent of like alcohol is present. I'm, for me and my money, and I'm like all these mental health practitioners and there's elements of suicide and you know, I'm always like, what? Man, I would talk about that one. But that's just me. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It might be coming. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It might be coming. It might be coming. But I do know in...

Samantha Lander (27:32.542)
yeah.

Samantha Lander (27:39.609)
Right? They need a sober person in there. It's probably coming. We'll let them know.

Freddie Kimmel (27:49.401)
in the United States. Now I'm probably not up on the stats like you are, but I'm pretty sure the trend of drinking is down in younger generations.

Samantha Lander (27:58.035)
yeah. I mean, I see it firsthand. I'm throwing these big sober rave events and they're just like, it's, there's a lot, there's a lot of perimenopausal women cause we can't drink anymore. So we either stop or they're just gained like 10 pounds. So they just won't even do it. But then there's a lot of young kids. This sober movement is like so powerful. Like it, it, it's so much easier to get sober. It's so much more accepted. It's sort of like the cool thing to do.

I don't know if they're doing other things, amount of neurotropic drinks that are out there. It's insane. I mean, they're everywhere. You see them when we like go to a conference, it's left and right. So I think that people are, yeah, I mean, these little younger generations, I mean, they are healthy. They take care of themselves. Pretty cool.

Freddie Kimmel (28:46.384)
Yeah, it's pretty wild, pretty inspiring to see. I definitely have moments of great hope for the future. But today, you're sober. And so can you take us from the Sam who started drinking after her pregnancy to your next or your current leg of sobriety? Like what happened? What turned the corner for you?

Samantha Lander (28:50.171)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (29:09.531)
Oh God, I hit such a bottom. Um, I, mean, I couldn't stop. Like I just, I just, can't even sometimes put words to how hard it was to try to stop drinking. And I tried and I tried and I tried and I went to meetings and I, I told my parents that I needed to go to outpatient rehab. I would like call the friend at the time and I was like, I think I'm going to have to borrow money and just like go into a rehab maybe. Cause I didn't know like what it was going to cost. Cause my insurance wouldn't cover it all. I mean, I remember

I felt like I was screaming at the top of my lungs, like you guys, need help. And here's what I got was like, you did it before. You're fine. You were in prison. You're fine. Like you did. You were in prison for years. Like you're fine. Just stop. And that's what I kept getting. And I'm like, it's not working. And it's so silly, but here's what worked.

is I prayed why I'm praying for a boyfriend at the time, but I was praying for a guy who was like six feet tall, covered in tattoos, had a kid and was sober. And I, I literally that went through my mind and I was like, I just, and I remember I was really struggling with, I was trying to automate my business and go fully into like FDN and only functional stuff and no more personal training. And I couldn't even like create an automation. Like my brain was so fried. Like I couldn't think.

And I thought by switching my business over, would get me sober because I would have to use my brain more and that would work and that didn't. So I prayed for this guy. I met him the next day and it was probably one of the most like loving humans, amazing, supportive, at least in my mind. I don't know if I would even talk to him today, but it was everything that I like needed to have just like a mesh into my life. I fell hardcore in love with him. I relapsed.

one time he kind of let that one go. And then I did it again that he knows of. I was just a mess, put it that way. And he was done. So I had a human walk out of my life due to my addiction is how I have to look at it is that that guy was nothing but an act of my higher power, giving me exactly what I want to rip it out of my hands in order to get me to wake the fuck up and get sober because that's

Samantha Lander (31:24.803)
That's all that happened. It's the only thing that I can think of is I relapse. This guy walked out of my life. And for me to lose a human being to be so, to be so disgusting is kind of, think in my mind, like to be such an alcoholic to the point where this guy who loves me won't even be around me was really, really powerful. And I was done. I haven't even thought about it since then. that's all I can think of is like that was

He was my little vessel that popped in. It's like a union worker with tattoos. Yeah, right.

Freddie Kimmel (31:56.562)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (32:00.4)
Lessons from the universe, however they arrive.

That's amazing. so here we are today and you're functioning and high, high, functioning. In fact, the other day on the phone, you go, I have a quality of life that I never dreamed of in part to some of the like wonderful modalities and therapies that you and I both think are really powerful. One of them was peptides. that really, for some reason that

Samantha Lander (32:08.068)
Yeah.

them.

Samantha Lander (32:21.52)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (32:30.555)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (32:33.124)
I heard that a couple times, like coming up to our interview. It's delivered me a quality of life that I never dreamed of. That's a pretty powerful statement.

Samantha Lander (32:40.229)
Yeah. Yeah. I would wake up when I started using peptides and utilizing them. I remember, I mean, it took a little bit. I mean, I remember feeling better, but then I remember there just was like a, at one point there was like a click where I feel like I woke up and had like tears in my eyes every day because I was like, I feel like I'm walking on water.

Like I feel like I'm walking on water. was like, and I would be like the power of the peptides. It would just like go in my head. like, and I wouldn't even think of it. just like the power of the peptides. Like I'm walking on water and like, I mean, they really are like they, I do all the things, right? I started seeing a womb healer around the same time. So I think the combination of the two was very powerful, but it wasn't because I cleaned up my gut health. wasn't cause I balanced my hormones. I mean, I do all that. It was because I learned how to.

down regulate a nervous system that has been an overdrive since I, mean, I'm 45 or 40. God knows how many years let's say, it, give me, let's say until I was five, whatever, you know, 40 years of being on total overdrive type a always just go, go, go, go. I was the youngest of all the kids. When I, when we ask anyone like my mom or my aunt, they're always like, yeah, you were always keeping up. You were always keeping up. When we think of you, you were always keeping up with older kids and

That's been my story. And so when I got someone who could help help me calm and re-regulate my nervous system in a way that I can't, I can't do it. Like I literally can't do it. I've tried everything and then doing peptides, my, my world changed everything about it to the, my work, to how I wake up, to how I breathe, to how I feel, my relationship with my child completely changed everything.

Freddie Kimmel (34:27.982)
so powerful. And with great power comes great responsibility. I've said this to you and it's kind of been on my mind lately that because they are a... Let me do this first. Define a peptide for the audience. What's your definition for a peptide?

Samantha Lander (34:29.04)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (34:33.743)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (34:48.997)
So, okay. So a peptide is a molecule that is going to send signals to different receptors in the body and basically turn them on, turn them off and tell them what they need to do. A lot of, a lot of receptors I would say are dimmed or broken or not working well. And that's why we're having trouble reaching a health goal or we have a symptom that would probably be the most easiest way. So like a little text message that goes out and turns on and turns off things in our body that we

need to function and feel like we're walking on water.

Freddie Kimmel (35:22.96)
Yeah. So give me an example, like BPC157, body protection compound, is one many people have heard of. Not everybody. A lot of peptides are, just the conversation is new for most people. So what is that short chain amino acid? What is it and what is it doing in the body?

Samantha Lander (35:42.885)
So it's going to go in and it's going to actually repair your tissue. And you know what I mean? And they call it what were Wolverine because you can regrow and repair so well when you take it. So I always say that that's the one that's going to sort of like bring the tissue together. It's going to heal the gut. It's going to repair, you know, injuries, ligaments, tendons, things like that. I used it when I had my dental surgery. So for me, it was really,

Good. I did it with the TB 500, which brought down the inflammation part for me. So I would bring down inflammation and then repair as much as I could tissue around my teeth as I was having, you know, 30 surgeries on my mouth. So that's layman's term. would say, like to keep it.

Freddie Kimmel (36:26.663)
Yeah. And so because we opened the cookie jar on your dental, your dental stream of consciousness, which weaves into the addiction stream, which brings us to where we are today. Can you tell us the, the, the TLDR of your biological dentist story? What happened to your mouth?

Samantha Lander (36:46.157)
my gosh. So I always say, I always started, well, I was there. I was like, what happened? I'm like, I was a mouth reader and I was a thumb sucker and I deviated septum and I smoked meth. That's always like that. okay. Well, maybe it's that. So the wreckage of our past, right? So I, but I don't know, you know, when my mouth actually started to really just fall apart and that was, you know, four years ago, maybe three and a half.

Freddie Kimmel (36:57.895)
that.

Samantha Lander (37:13.979)
when I was with my beautiful guy. um, I don't know. Sometimes I wonder if it was COVID, like I got COVID and then my mouth got really bad because I had a friend of mine who got COVID and all her teeth just falling out. She got the vaccine. Yeah. I do wonder and there aren't enough studies or anything. I've asked all the big bio dentists and they, you know, they're like, well, maybe, you know, they come up with their theory, but, but I also had my dad has bad teeth and I was smoke meth. um,

Freddie Kimmel (37:27.911)
Really? Huh.

Samantha Lander (37:43.259)
I basically started getting really, really sick again and I was chronically fatigued and just felt awful and going to every doctor, getting the ENT. I had multiple ENTs that I fired, CTs in my face trying to figure out why I felt so sick. I thought it was a sinus infection and it turned out to be a cracked tooth and that was the start of it. And basically, dentist is just gonna pull a tooth.

they want to do a root canal. Like everything is a root canal because they want to keep you pretty. And so I got a root canal. I got better for a little bit and then everything went to shit. Like my mouth just hurt. I was chronically sick and I just started pulling teeth out. So I sort of then got introduced to like biological dentistry and realized that at the bottom of a root canal, you know, they don't pull out all the bacteria. There tends to be more of an infection at the bottom. I always say within a year you're going to start building some sort of infection. That's just my theory. So

that's what was happening is I had, you know, infections in my mouth and I did cavitation, so it was not better. I pulled out the entire upper left side. I was not better. I started pulling out the bottom left side. Wasn't better. I pulled out every root canal pretty much that I could on that left side because I had to eat on the other side.

I did have one upper right tooth that they thought that you could clearly see on a cone beam scan, which is what they do, that there was an infection. It was like an old root canal tooth, but I just like, like, I just wasn't going to do it because I needed to be able to eat. I got the deviated septum surgery redone. They thought it was because I had cysts my sinuses. I did that pole surgery, went, got a molar pulled the next day. Molar just popped out of my jaw. Never seen anything like it.

I was better after that for about two months and then I got sick again. And at this point we're slowly getting implants put in and like rebuilding the left side. So things were sort of progressing. Once I got my, my implants on the upper left and was able to sort of eat on that side and I got one on the bottom, we started working on the other side. So we pulled that infected teeth out. I did not feel any different. And I kept telling them, like I'm telling you there, there's something on my bottom left because I kept getting a really inflamed gum.

Samantha Lander (40:00.325)
but there was like, there was no evidence of anything looking back because it's hard to tell with the teeth, but I was getting referral pain up into my upper left sinus. And at this point I'm living off antibiotics, I'm living off steroids and I finally said, you know what, screw it, just pull the two, pull that one that hurts me all the time. And we pulled that one and I got about six months of feeling absolutely amazing. And then, and I started adding in peptides.

after that upper, that upper infected tooth got pulled. And so I think things were moving along with that. That was definitely helping my immune system be able to like heal and fight things. And I pulled one more. Then I started getting sick again. I'm like, fuck it. I go just pull the last root canal. We pulled the last root canal. I've been fine since then. Just about. mean, cold weather, think definitely make my teeth feel funny. There's definitely a lot of weird nuances, but I had like bone spiculas, which is like bone just popping out of your jaw.

I had to go and like grind down jawbone that was, I was healing probably because of peptides. was healing so fast and so well that like the way that my gums would heal over the bone of my jaw, we'd have to go like shave my jawbone down because it would just start protruding through my gums. I would just heal. They're like, what are you taking? I'm like peptides. And they're like, why are you like healing so fast? I mean, I had one of the screws of my implant come out and he's like, you need to get in here now because what's going to happen is that.

the gum over it's going to heal before we get, I was getting a crown that, know, within two to two or three days, I'm like, why can't we just leave it? He's like, no, no, no, not with you. Literally in three hours it healed over and they had to like a rip through my gum to try to do it. He's like, you and you peptide, you need to stop. But yeah, it's just, it was something 30 surgeries. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (41:42.394)
Wow. Wow. I really... Guys, take care of your teeth. I really have no words. There is, in our, in the Academy, Biological Blueprint Academy on the website, Dr. Gene Sampataros, and there is our biological dentist, and we, you know, we walk through all the different diagnostic work you should do, and the periodontal support, and even being as bullish as having an ozone machine at home to...

Samantha Lander (41:57.305)
Yeah, I love him.

Freddie Kimmel (42:11.313)
make bubbled ozone water and do mouth rinses with that. I there's so many great things we can do. Are there peptides that are teeth and gum specific that people are using today?

Samantha Lander (42:23.621)
So I'm not trying to do a shameless plug because I can. So oral, I just started using oral tide pro. so that is a concentrated Mark mouthwash that has a bunch of peptides in it. So they say that this is amazing just for like rebuilding, like the minerals of your teeth and things like that. But for me, my God, I don't know. I was so far gone. I don't think, I don't know. So peptide. So I think if you have,

Freddie Kimmel (42:26.503)
That's fine, plug.

Samantha Lander (42:52.359)
anything to build bone and make your teeth and your jawbones and things like that stronger. But for actual like mouth health, I would say like probably those did the mouth wash, but I did, I was doing them to try to help like heal the teeth tissue and regenerate tissue so I could get my implants sooner or not be so I had like crot like horrible inflammation always right here. The second I start what you can ask Gene, he thinks I'm not so was like, yeah.

I like to send him a message. was like, dude, I just injected VPC and TB into my gums. He's like, what? They're like, what about hitting a nerve? I'm like, I don't know. Like, I didn't even think about it. Like, I've been through so much pain. I've had root canals and things like with no, my dentist knows not even asked to get me numb anymore because I don't want to do it. But I literally like did it up into my gums and like all the inflammation went away.

So I would say, mean, obviously like diamonds and alpha one, if your immune system, if you have stuff going on with your teeth, you need to support your immune system. Like I think that would be a good one. I don't know.

Freddie Kimmel (43:52.893)
It's just such a hidden area, in the world of, you know, again, if you identify as somebody who's chronically ill, people always skip the teeth till last. Or go do a cone beam scan. If you've ever had a root canal, the odds are, man, more often than not, hear people say that, you know, the odd, I didn't realize that they had actually mummified this infection in the bottom of the tooth forever. And so that's definitely something to look at if you're one of those people.

Samantha Lander (44:02.285)
yeah.

Samantha Lander (44:17.243)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (44:21.852)
And then we do have, yeah, who do you love for a biological dentist? I tell people the Julian Center is phenomenal in

Samantha Lander (44:28.027)
God, love it. So I went like nuts. So I interviewed all the big guys on my IG live. Like that's all I did. Like such addicts, such addict behavior. Like I obsessed. I have a tattoo, a tooth with a bow. I was like, so I was like, just need a good tooth on my body. So I love Kelly, Dr. Kelly Bouguette. I love Dr. Dom. My dentist is Dr. Ramey. He's great for the Midwest. He's really building his practice. He's now doing ceramic implants. He's really getting into.

he hasn't gotten into peptides. He's like, that's the whole thing. go in there. I'm like, you need to do peptides. There's like three, there's just three you could probably add in. That would be amazing. but Ramey is really good. there's a Christian, Dr. Christian, he is, he is like an aesthetic bio, biological dentist. So he does things a little different. He's very into like making everything look really, really good, but also integrating the biological dentistry part of it.

But anyone that is going to like be able to look at like if you have like, I think mercury, if you have mercury fillings, just get them out, go to a biological dentist, use a smart technique, get them out. But that's where you see a lot of the rashes that are, see like people with psoriasis and eczema when I do an intake and they have that, I'm like, okay, is there a metal in your mouth? I'm like, okay, we could look at a GI panel, but you probably need to get the metal out of your mouth, you know? But when it comes, I always say go back to like old school and look at the...

you know, the organ Meridian chart and see where your body hurts and see how many things you can link to teeth. Like why was my big toe always just like locked up? Like I didn't never even thought about it. Like super locked up ever since that started like to the T my left knee always hurt my, my lungs. Like I felt like I couldn't breathe. Like I felt like I had a hiatal hernia and like, just couldn't like, I couldn't get a deep breath. One of my teeth, which one was it?

I think it was this first bottom right, but they pulled it. No, no, no. It was the upper left infected one. They pulled it and I felt like my lung capacity quadrupled. My knee pain went away within 20 minutes after walking out the door and I sat in that chair after they did it. And I cried like hysterically, like hysterically for like that ugly shit for 45 minutes. No idea why. Like I was just like,

Freddie Kimmel (46:44.82)
Mmm.

Samantha Lander (46:47.227)
You know, and so it's they're powerful. Like there's so many nerves running through. got sidetracked on that. But those are some good guys. Those are some good guys, I think. And he is amazing. Oh, he is.

Freddie Kimmel (46:53.234)
No, it's good.

It's important. Dr. Kelly is coming here Wednesday to Austin. Yeah, his whole team's coming out. So we're gonna do a big sauna, big wellness day.

Samantha Lander (47:07.259)
he'll talk about dogma a lot. He's really into dogma. That's like his word. He's a good guy. He so in the midst, this is a, this is a God moment is like in the midst of my dark darkness, my many dark phases of the mouth. Cause I mean, when you're in pain like that, it's, it's, it was worse probably than my addiction in some respects, because at least you could numb yourself. You know, I was sober through all this. So like, at least I could like check out when using drugs, but I could not this time. And

Freddie Kimmel (47:12.092)
I love it.

Samantha Lander (47:35.163)
I remember I saw a picture because I had a live, I had IG live booked with him, but we hadn't done it yet. And he posted a picture with the arch behind him, which is in St. Louis. And I was like, what? I was like, wait a second. And so I sent out and I DMed him and I sent a text and I think I had his cell phone. And I was like, what, you're in town? was like, can you please meet me? Please just meet me. Like I just needed, like, I just wanted help. And he met me.

at like 6 15 in the morning before his flight left down at his hotel. And we talked for like two hours about everything in my mouth. And he was just like, my God. And I was like, I know. And that was just the beginning of it. So he's, he's a good one.

Freddie Kimmel (48:15.664)
Everybody said he was recommended Jen Heller recommended. She's like you got to talk to Kelly. He's so great Yeah, yeah, that's amazing. That's amazing So Sam today like on on I want to say the other side, but are we really ever on the other side? You know is your you said it very well You had these streams that have come together to create a moment today Where everything feels really incredible like I'm like I'm floating

Samantha Lander (48:20.569)
Kelly something. yeah. Yeah. Kelly. He's a good one. You'll have fun. You'll have a blast.

Samantha Lander (48:33.731)
and health.

Freddie Kimmel (48:45.118)
How are you serving today? How are you helping? How are you working in the world of wellness?

Samantha Lander (48:50.043)
That's so funny. Cause that's part of the, that's part of the 12 steps is like acts. You have to act of service, like service work keeps us sober, right? So if I work with people who are struggling and trying to stay sober, that's what keeps me sober. So it's like doing something outside yourself. That's that's selfless. Like you have to be selfless in life, I think to do well. So I go down into juvenile detention.

So I'll work with those girls. They are definitely not addicts or any of that. I thought it would be a bunch of like just drug addict girls that were like me and they're like, it's like violent crime. It's like, it's, it's hardcore. They grow up in very, very, very dysfunctional homes, a lot of violence. Like one girl ended up, they call it certifying. So they wait till they're certified and they can try them as an adult. And then they give them more time and they put them in like prison. And so

Sometimes I'll hold them. So I go and I'll work with those girls and just kind of work on their belief system or like play Pictionary, like whatever, just be a role model. And then in, in recovery, you do work with, you know, people who are struggling or newbies. I speak on any platform that I can about recovery or my story. I would say like my, my sober events, my rave workouts and my wellness events like that.

I mean, I do make money off them. So I don't think that's considered necessarily service work. I do think it's good for the St. Louis community for people to have an outlet like that. But I'll get in newspapers, I'll ask the news to do a just like, hey, can we get on there and let's talk about alcohol and recovery month or I try to integrate and like the mom networks. So I'm actually, I do a blog, I did a couple of blogs for like the mom STL moms like

Freddie Kimmel (50:14.014)
Mm-hmm.

Samantha Lander (50:37.411)
Instagram people because that's a big part of it. So now they integrate mocktails. They make sure that's on the flyers and things like that. So people know that like there's going to be a mocktail there for you. Like it's, it's becoming, it's just so much easier though. But yeah, anything I can to like just sort of scream anything addiction, I'm there for it. And I don't expect anything in return. I talked to the biohackers and I tell them, stop being stupid and drinking, like go buy all your things, but like just quit. The cheapest hack you could do is quit drinking.

Freddie Kimmel (50:55.828)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (51:07.107)
In my opinion. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (51:07.444)
It's powerful. It's powerful. It just one... Yeah, I'm 48 and so one... Even one cocktail, I just don't sleep well. I just don't recover well. I wish I did. I wish I did, but it's... Yeah, it's like a... What's that?

Samantha Lander (51:17.455)
Yeah. yeah. Yeah.

That's your liver working. That's your liver working in the middle of the night to try to detox it. Yeah, it does not.

Freddie Kimmel (51:29.138)
Yeah. Yeah, but it's wild when you're all, when you're numb to it. And because I have, I have friends that drink every day and they don't, they get up, you know, appearingly fine. You know, they're not, don't feel hung over, but they're, I really do think, I think you're numb to the impact. At least I, and I think, I do think there are those of us that are more sensitive given like our unique history that yeah, you have less, you have bandwidth to work with, to be stupid.

Samantha Lander (51:58.331)
Yeah. Yeah. I think your terrain matters for sure. But I think that people, it's like, if people don't know what it feels like to not have inflammatory food in their body, like if they do a food sensitivity test, then they realize after three weeks of not eating it, they're like, holy shit. I almost like when they go and they like plow down a funnel cake or something like that. And they realize how bad they felt. Like people don't know until they know is what I think. Um, and I think people define, um, I'm okay drinking because I don't get hung over.

But like they don't, things are happening. Once you get on a phone call, once I get on a phone call with people and I asked the right questions, all of sudden you're like, they're like, no, I'm pretty good. I'm This. And then they start, they don't know how to put like perimenopo, like having hot flashes and night sweats. They may not be even be linking that to their drinking. So they don't even think of it as a symptom of the drink, you know? And so until you realize what happens and all the symptoms that come paired with having that glass of wine or whatever you're having, you don't,

correlate it like we do. That's why we have jobs.

Freddie Kimmel (53:02.185)
Bad decisions are what happens. Bad decisions. My uncle used to be like, nothing good happens. Nothing good happens after 9.30 at night. You should be home. You shouldn't be out.

Samantha Lander (53:11.855)
Right, right. Coming from the girl here who DJs raves. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (53:17.181)
Right, right. Well, there's definitely that alternative culture now to support that. What about, like, let's, I do want to talk about, I want to talk about peptides without getting banned. I don't know if we'll be able to use these clips on Instagram anymore because just left and right accounts are being pulled down. And we said, we said this once, I said this once, I said, with great power comes great responsibility. You know, I'm such a huge fan of, like, the impact of these simple signaling molecules, but I'm also

Samantha Lander (53:29.647)
I

Freddie Kimmel (53:45.287)
I believe like I had cancer and Lyme for a reason and part of my narrative arc is that I did start to listen to my body. I did start to realize the pain was, it's not just pain. You have tumor and multiple tumors inside you or you know, your chronic fatigue syndrome, your brain is not draining. And so these are things that we have these powerful signaling molecules now accessible to pretty much everybody if you want to go get it, pretty much everybody anywhere.

Samantha Lander (53:59.515)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (54:13.173)
How do you balance that ability to meet somebody where they're at and want to help them to feel better, but also honor the innate signal of the body? Your disease process is unfolding for a reason at this time.

Samantha Lander (54:26.105)
Yeah. I think, well, you know, every, every person you meet is a individual. So you have to treat them that way. And when people, know, peptides are a big buzzword. So obviously they'll, that could be what, what brings them in the door. And I always tell them very, very quick, very, very momentous.

Freddie Kimmel (55:04.462)
We're good. Test one two. I can't hear you. Try again. now I can. Great. Great. Hold on, let me just mark that. Great. Fucking thing. I wonder why it's doing that.

Samantha Lander (55:07.963)
You can't hear me? Can you hear me? Okay.

Samantha Lander (55:18.149)
We almost made it.

Freddie Kimmel (55:19.692)
I know, I usually don't edit. This is beautiful part, is I don't have to edit. Because I'm like, I just don't do it. But there's something going on, and it's so funny. I just bought a new cable. I wonder why she likes to drop out. Hmm.

Samantha Lander (55:32.987)
Is it at the same time every time?

Freddie Kimmel (55:35.364)
It's like a little ways into the app, like 45 minutes in. Nothing gets bumped.

Samantha Lander (55:38.947)
It could be like something overloads.

Freddie Kimmel (55:42.626)
Yeah, it's weird, I just replaced the USB-C cable. And I swapped out the headphones. Hmm, I wonder if it's just the software.

Samantha Lander (55:47.579)
Huh? That's what I would think. Or your computer is just like, whoo. Minds of math right now. Yeah. I do have a software guy. I do remind me to tell you about the software guy. Cause you were saying that's your thing. All right. So I tell people, I think I know where I was filming it ago. All right. So when I work with people, um, you know, I always say like it's you, you have to treat the individual.

Freddie Kimmel (55:53.902)
brand new MacBook. Is that?

Freddie Kimmel (56:01.169)
all right. Well, let me... Yeah.

Samantha Lander (56:15.707)
as if they're a unicorn in some, I don't work with zebras, I don't work with horses. My clients are very unicorns and most people are, like we're all very, very unique. they come in and peptides is a buzzword, so I get a lot of people coming in wanting peptides and wanting a GLP and Rettutrutide and all the things. But I think that the most important thing that they need to understand is like, we need to look at your terrain, we need to build a

Program for you and not just sell you like I'm not gonna sell you peptides so that in order to do that you have to build the house and I like to build the house so I You got to work on nutrition like number one like to see whole foods like come on and move your body, know Get in the sunlight. Let's get those things down because you're not doing that Nothing else is gonna work like these things do they work They're a great tool to add your toolbox But if you're not if you don't get the foundational stuff the second you stop them, eventually, you're gonna feel bad again

And most people probably don't have the investment or the income to just stay on peptides and rotate them for the rest of their life. Maybe. I mean, I probably will, but I'm working to that. you know, and then you have to look at your hormones, optimize hormones and detox pathways and, and gut health. You know, I will not work with anyone who's even if they're coming in they just want to do peptide work. I always look at the gut, no matter what.

I don't care what they say. I don't care how many GI panels they've run with every other practitioner in the world. I always do a GI panel to make sure I'm checking that box because I don't feel like the peptides will work as well. You won't be set up for success later when you try to take any supplements. Like I think that looking at, know, you got to heal the gut. You got to get infections down. You got to get, lot of people are having histamine reactions a lot. Like a lot of people are reacting to peptides.

And then they're like, well, I blame it because I got it from this website. It's the peptide. And it's really not, it's your body telling you another, another thing that you need to listen to. And I don't think that the people who can just go buy it online, understand that like, maybe you need to do some antihistamine work and some GI panels and then get on secretagogues. then like, it doesn't mean you can't use them, but you got to optimize before you throw in, you know, certain peptides. think it's important to educate. So.

Freddie Kimmel (58:35.544)
Yeah, I'd love your opinion on this because the public, for the most part, the public taking like the most groundbreaking weight loss drug in the history of humankind, and there's no real education on maintaining that balance of skeletal muscle, of lifestyle adjustments. What do you think will happen on a longer timeline as we see everybody

on a GLP.

Samantha Lander (59:06.427)
Well, I think the early generation GLPs, we're going to have more studies, which I think are coming out that there are going to be more side effects with how that it burns more muscle and not as much visceral fat. think you'll see like there's a lot of like eye stuff coming out. I think those early, the early ones were going to start to see more evidence. But what I think is we have, you know, red atriotide, which is the newest one that's probably going to be available FDA approved fairly soon.

And it's interesting because in my personal opinion, that one doesn't, that doesn't dim the, the food noise like the other ones and you're still hungry. So you still want to eat. So if you haven't worked on your ability to understand like, okay, this is probably about what I should be eating. I need to eat these whole foods. If you're just like taking a GLP, like the early generation that really dim the food noise and really make you not want to eat and not hungry and all the things.

that's easy to lose weight on, right? Because you don't have to do the work to understand why you probably had some food addiction or disordered eating or whatever it is. mean, most people do, let's be honest. And I think that I don't know if it's going to work as well. I honestly wonder if it's going to work as well, because if you are, and I think microdosing will become more of a thing.

because people, do feel like people are learning to do that. A lot of the med spas and all the people who doing high doses are now going down to micro dosing. So I wonder if the early ones that where you still want to eat, you're still hungry and it doesn't kick that food noise as much are going to be as successful as the early ones. People want an easy fix.

Freddie Kimmel (01:00:48.869)
Yeah, I always think about the equation of if people, because today the reality is people are overeating, but from a nutrient standpoint, it's scarce. The palates, the polyphenols, the colors, the minerals, the protein requirements, it's not great quality foods. And then we're taking this nutrient profile and then we're diminishing that. And so I just wonder about like,

Samantha Lander (01:01:02.809)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:01:17.506)
the epithelial linings, I wonder about circulation, wonder about bone density, that...

Samantha Lander (01:01:23.035)
Oh, I think the bone density is going to go down. that's going to be a big one. mean, this, I mean, you'll hear it from practitioners who are educated. They're like, just eat protein, protein, protein, protein, protein, like make sure you're getting it. Or, I mean, the GLBs don't even like, I don't think, I don't find that that red, like red or true tide works that well. If someone isn't eating enough, it won't work. Like it doesn't work. And if you don't like work on thyroid or why your thyroid function might be off and like, you really just have to look, you got to look at it as a tool.

in your toolbox to help you push the needle and turn things on. But why not? I always tell my clients like with the GLP is like, why not go fix? What if we could fix the cells that are, you know, the mitochondria that's causing the weight loss resistance, like, cool. You're doing all the work. We've got all the foundations laid out. Let's do some GLP and microdose. But like, what if I could tell you we could go in and fix the weight loss resistance that you've had your entire life and you may not even need a GLP.

Like, they love the sound of that. They're like, oh, wait, what? You know, like, cause I don't think some, like you teach them, you teach the children that you may not, you know, how to play, right. And then you educate them that, maybe we could fix it in long-term by doing, you know, that's where like Moxie and SS 31 are beautiful. You know, you can bring those in, you can bring some other fat burners so they don't get addicted to a GLP. I think you really got to be smart about it. And you have to think.

of the individual, you have to look at, you know, on intake, you've got to understand their behaviors. And that's where like, I'm lucky because I'm an addict. So I can pick them up really quickly where we're going to have a little bit of a disconnect and not some of them. I'm like, I'm not putting you on a DLP. There's no way, but I'll put them on other things like five amino one and Q or things like that where they're not so aggressive. I mean, you have to be careful with like oxytocin in an addict because you feel so flush and all those things. Like I worry about that. So long answer.

Freddie Kimmel (01:03:17.7)
talk? No, it's a great answer, but I want to do some clarity for the audience that might not know SS31 and MOTC. What are those two peptides, MOTC and SS31? How are they different and why would people use them?

Samantha Lander (01:03:18.395)
you

Samantha Lander (01:03:33.051)
All right. So I use them to go in and fix the mitochondria and the mitochondria inside your body is the fuel for your metabolic health. So if you have had a metabolic dumpster fire your entire life, what if we go in and we fix a cell that's going to like fuel that we're to get rid of that fire and we're going to get your body just burning and doing the things that it should be doing. And so SS 31 is helps the outside of that cell not be leaky. So just like a leaky gut, the cell becomes leaky.

That's why it's not moving and doing its job. And then the inner part of the cell is like the energy. So that's like your little like, you know, your adrenals of the cell, whatever you want to call it. It's gonna, it's gonna move things along. And so that's where the MOTC turns that on. So we've got the molecule, we're turning these receptors on to heal and then put energy into that cell, which is then going to fuel your metabolic health. So then what, you know, then we're working on kicking weight loss resistance, adding in lifestyle.

teaching people to eat, and move, then things should work well.

Freddie Kimmel (01:04:37.764)
And is that something where if you think about the cell membrane and the leaky cell, SS31, is that something you'd use first and then go in and work on the engine like Masi after, or can you use those in conjunction?

Samantha Lander (01:04:50.683)
Oh, you can use them in conjunction, but I do think everyone's different. Like I know that for me, the first round I did SS 31 and MOTC together, but then all of a sudden my, HRV went nuts. And I was like, what is happening? Like it was like, I wasn't, and I wasn't sleeping as well. I mean, there is an adjustment period with every peptide and that's the stuff like.

If you don't, if you haven't been working and practicing with many people, you, don't think you'll learn it any other way and asking questions and asking people who've been doing a lot longer than you, like that's where humility and being egoist comes into play where like, I'm like, my God, what's happening? I need help. And cause they're, they're, they're pretty safe molecules, but like there's things that are going to happen. And the MOTC was kicking my ass. Like that energy was like,

a little too much for me. So I had to lower my dose and space it out more and go slower. But I did drop down to the SS 31. This is just from my personal experience. Like I, the SS 31, I did that for like, you know, I did probably four weeks of that and then slowly put the MOTC back in. And then I was able to handle it just fine. But it is one that'll make you super speedy. If you don't, you got to talk to your, that's why you book calls, you book calls, you talk to people because they don't know wearables are great with peptides. Like I see at,

At with rather true to that, see it eight weeks and I see it 18 weeks sleep gets disrupted and HRV can go really wacky. And I've seen it enough times to think that, know, that's, that's your body working. It's good, but you got to coach someone through that. Like it's okay. Like it's going to get better. It always gets better, but it's just something about your body is like shifting and learning how to turn things on again. It's totally shut off for years. If anyone's probably going on a GLP, that's probably why.

depending on what, if you're using it for weight, you know.

Freddie Kimmel (01:06:41.381)
Yeah, and then who, how to, obviously again, this is I just want to reiterate. I hope people get the, I hope you start to pick up the thread that it's like these things are powerful. You don't want to jump on, you don't want to jump off, you don't want to buy peptides in the internet and willy-nilly, you go mixing them yourself and dosing them yourself. It's only bad things are going to come from it. I mean, on a big enough timeline, let's say that. Because then the other thing I just want to mention is how would one come off

Samantha Lander (01:06:53.744)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (01:06:59.247)
now.

Freddie Kimmel (01:07:08.996)
Some of these peptides and like be reintroduced into the wild without using them I mean you said a couple times you're like well I'm gonna cycle through things forever because I love them But let's say somebody does want to transition off. How do you support them metabolically?

Samantha Lander (01:07:19.865)
I didn't know.

Samantha Lander (01:07:24.815)
Yeah. Well, I think it's important to, you know, to understand that like peptides are great in cycles. And when you turn something on, you, should be able to stop it. Right. That's the goal is, is that's what I mean by cycles. Some I'll never do again. I hope, you know, but I think that the good thing is a peptide is a really, really short half life. So when you stop them, you typically are okay. It doesn't, it's not going to have like a huge like detox or anything like that. I personally, and

professionally have never seen that happen. I think that you, if you do it during the duration that you need to, you know, you can stop it. But if you're going to stop something that is necessarily going to be like a fat burner or, you know, something for growth hormone and things like that, you, you still need to maintain all the foundational stuff of eating right movement, lifting, lifting, lifting, lifting, high protein. And you should be okay. Like

I tell people who might have a reaction to a pet, let's say they get a rash from a peptide, it's going to be gone. It'll be out of your system in 24 hours. Typically. Like it is a very short half life. And that's what's great. If you have a reaction, the first time I did test of Morlin, a very first time I was, I didn't know how to dose things as well. Like I couldn't, you know what I mean? Like this is it. This is why like you coach people through. Like I did almost, an entire, like a, like a hundred units.

on a Sarange of Tessa. And if you know about Tessa Moreland, can make women especially super puffy and bloated. I mean, it knocked me out. Like I was so puffy, so bloated. I was like, I think I dumped this wrong. I know what's happening. I was like, oh my God. I mean, I literally should have done like, you know, a quarter of like so much less than that, but go low and slow, man. Start really slow is always a good thing. You don't need more. Some people don't need as

Freddie Kimmel (01:09:16.239)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (01:09:18.619)
the full dose, you know, I'm a tiny human. Like you got to take these things into consideration. Like some people are like, I'm to do this. I'm going to do a ton. And I'm an addict, man. I think like that. Like I want to do, I want to do a lot of peptides. I'm going to just like at first I was like, this is so hard. It's so tiny. Like it's such a tiny amount. Like I want more, but no.

Freddie Kimmel (01:09:19.865)
Yeah. Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:09:29.423)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:09:37.625)
Yeah, you don't eat a lot. Where would you send physicians and coaches, patient advocates for training on peptides? you have? Okay.

Samantha Lander (01:09:45.723)
Peptide University for sure. absolutely yeah, I'm now faculty on the set with Peptide University. I did tons of certifications and educational platforms and I think that they do an excellent job covering all the bases tapping to everything that we have spoken about. They are not there to sell peptides at all. They are there to support the peptide community and to help you learn how to build programs, run the business.

understand how, you know, how to stay safe, how to not get locked down, how to do merchant accounts, like the legal aspect of it is really important. The disclaimers, the consents, the, you know, can we do it with a pregnant woman? Can we do it with someone who has cancer? Like all of these things are covered along with peptide education. And some of the people, the fact I'm like, I feel so grateful. I'm like so blessed to be a part of it, but their, their staff and the people who do master classes are just brilliant. Melissa's brilliant.

can't wait till you have her on your show. But yeah, yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:10:44.614)
Awesome. I can't wait. I can't wait. Amazing. Well, we're gonna close it down because we're a little bit over an hour. Yeah, I thank you for being here. Thank you for giving us your time and being so generous through this story. And I really hope, I hope people sit down and take this one for a walk and really take it to heart. There's a lot of gold here.

Samantha Lander (01:10:49.701)
Yeah. All right. We're good.

Samantha Lander (01:10:57.099)
I'm so excited.

Samantha Lander (01:11:08.891)
Yeah, it was a good one. I appreciate it. I'm so excited. I was so excited when you said, yeah, let's see. I was working all the networks. was like, Rene, do you know this guy?

Freddie Kimmel (01:11:14.366)
I so

Freddie Kimmel (01:11:20.088)
We have a common friend, which is the San Boteros and Renee Bells, and Renee has been on. And yeah, as a host, get 25 requests a week to come on, and everybody wants something. And so I never know anymore. like, I never know unless I have a connection with it. It's really hard to pick a guest. But Renee was like, you got to have her on. I was like, great, done.

Samantha Lander (01:11:41.564)
Yeah, I don't have a product. I'm not trying to sell anything. I think that's how I got so looped into with peptide university. Like I just kept referring people and like I just, I love what they're doing. Like I love what they're doing. I remember I just like, I was like, I so excited. I get like FOMO. I'm like, I am going to be on the faculty. I'm going to like, I want to speak. I want to teach on like peptides and addiction. like, I'm going to bring my whole life full circle. And then like literally like four weeks ago, I was like, she's like, you're going to do a masterclass. We need to do something for you. And I was like, what?

Freddie Kimmel (01:12:04.548)
Yeah.

Samantha Lander (01:12:10.267)
I was like, I'm not ready. She's like, you're ready. I'm like, So yeah, cool.

Freddie Kimmel (01:12:13.381)
I love it. I love it. What would be your one piece of advice to somebody out there that hears this podcast who is struggling with addiction? Where do they go first?

Samantha Lander (01:12:28.379)
I say go. Well, so I'm a meeting girl. So whether it were, know there's a lot of sober coaches out there, but I would say get to a meeting, get to an AA meeting or NA meeting, raise your hand and tell people your day count and that you're struggling and whether you choose to continue that program, it doesn't matter. You're going to meet a room full of people who are

just like you. And even if you don't think at the time that they're like you and your story is your unicorn and you're different, your addiction story is totally different, I promise you if you sit in those rooms long enough, you will relate more and more to other people's stories. And that's what's so cool is you'll go into a meeting and they will be the widest variety of people you'll ever meet, right? Just totally different backgrounds and demographics and all the things, but your stories will overlap.

And that's what keeps you sober is you'll hear your story in a meeting or you'll talk to someone and they are selfless. They should be selfless. I mean, obviously there's always going to be someone, but they are selfless and they truly want to help you stay sober until you can figure out another way. I'd say 90 and 90.

Freddie Kimmel (01:13:36.579)
Yeah. And then if you could give one piece of advice to that girl in seventh grade, is that when you had your first drink, what would you say to her?

Samantha Lander (01:13:51.891)
I have no regrets like with my life. Like I do. So my biggest regret was getting a up ground pool during COVID. That's like one of my top regrets. So what would I say?

Samantha Lander (01:14:08.603)
don't do drugs. No, no, I think that that it's always going to be okay. That there's always a silver, there's always a silver lining and that you have to be patient with it and that you're always going to get better. It may get worse, but it always, I feel like it always gets better and just don't give up on yourself. Be proactive and not reactive. You know, I think that there was something in me that always had like a very holistic heart.

And for me, like the fact that I denied all the Ritalin, I denied all the drugs, like I was on a lot of antibiotics, but I didn't know. like, I remember going to an iridologist, like I saved my money and like snuck out, like went to an iridologist, like when I was really, really young, like I don't even know how I found this person. And I remember they read my eyes and that's when I, they were like, yeah, you have hypothyroid and things like that. And I was really young and that like, was a game changer for me. So think I've always, you know, be open minded to that.

Freddie Kimmel (01:15:05.283)
Yeah, there's a layer in there from a past life somewhere that was a healer, I think.

Samantha Lander (01:15:09.113)
Yeah. yeah. yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (01:15:12.581)
Amazing. Amazing. Well, thank you for being with us this morning. Appreciate you and we'll see you again soon. Thank you, Sam.

Samantha Lander (01:15:13.913)
So thank you. Yeah. Thank you.