The Inflammation Code: Healing Burnout, Mold, and the Hidden Fire Within

WELCOME TO EPISODE 267

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Freddie Kimmel (00:01.322)
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the beautifully broken podcast. Another repeat offender we have Dr. Shivani Gupta. Welcome back to the show, my friend.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:11.562)
Thank you, thanks for having me.

Freddie Kimmel (00:13.642)
What a treat. I can't believe it. I can't believe it. Now, I have been watching your social media like a hawk. And I've, I see you've had a new guest in your home. Can we talk about that guest?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:21.736)
Nice.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:26.486)
I have the worst kind of guest you could ever invite in your life. Maybe there's worse. Maybe there's like rodents and things there. There could be worse. My guest of 2025 has been mold. And I know more about mold than I ever wanted to know. I know more about mold remediation than I ever wanted to know. And I do plan to go to the mold remediation courses and learn how you remediate mold so I can learn even better how I will never have this problem again.

Freddie Kimmel (00:40.75)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:55.954)
I'm like on a rampage on the mold tub.

Freddie Kimmel (00:56.024)
Hmm.

Yeah. You know, I love ideas and I love like when I, there's certain things that light up on my body. actually just created a, a value, a value offering for people in Austin. There's a concierge health service here called EverGuide. And we were talking about how I can help and we can collaborate with, with the show and the podcast and my area of expertise. And I was like, what if we did a healthy home walkthrough?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:28.118)
That's cool.

Freddie Kimmel (01:28.438)
And we talked about some, some, want to say this awareness level testing. So before we go to the $1,400 home inspectors and the VOC, VOC testing, what if we just did our healthy home walkthrough, like checking wet connections in the house around plumbing, assessing the attic, doing something simple, like a got mold test.

walking through different light, circadian rhythm, what does a sleep biome look like, and doing an actual walkthrough, because I think there's something different when you actually sit down, I know there is, we talk to somebody and I go in your house and I was like, wait, what is this? Even things as simple as like, how do you say you're a healthy person and you don't have a squatty potty? Like, I don't get it, there's big gaps in the education, right? We've skipped some steps. So I'm gonna be doing that in Austin.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (02:12.288)
Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (02:18.262)
you

Dr. Shivani Gupta (02:23.358)
yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (02:24.846)
Just a little, I'm not creating a business. I say all that to say the other business that I would love to do is healthy home building specifications. Like build a home that is not going to make you sick from the start because construction here is insane in Austin.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (02:37.534)
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (02:46.902)
It is, I think it is all over the US. And when I called you earlier this year, I was like, Freddie, I have mold, I need to fix it. What's the tool I can buy? Of course, because that's human nature. Like, what's the one thing I can buy that'll just fix this? Even though I'm in the integrative health space and I know that there's nothing like that. And I was like, Freddie, just come on. Is there a better PEMF mat than I have? Is there a better sauna? And I love it because you always give me the answer I do not want to hear. And you're always like, Shivani.

Freddie Kimmel (02:58.029)
Yes.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (03:16.402)
Sorry, sorry, no. It's either the $9,000 tools work or you gotta do the work. And by the way, you're not detoxing mold in three months. It's gonna take you two years. And I just remember thinking, Freddie, I have no such time. We're not doing that, But I always know that when I call you, you're gonna give it to me straight and you're always gonna tell me the real raw truth, even if I don't wanna hear it. So yeah, I'm obsessed with Healthy Home now too, because how can we not be in this space?

Freddie Kimmel (03:39.692)
Yeah. Yeah, I can't, I can't.

Freddie Kimmel (03:45.634)
I do not have it in my capacity to say otherwise. It's not that when, and listen, the call you give me, I get four a week where people are like, should I get this? Should I get that? I was like, I can make a case for against anything you're saying a hundred percent. They're all great. However, if the fundamentals are not covered and you're in a home that is making you sick, the $10,000 pulsed electromagnetic field generator or the sauna, it's really,

A, it's a bandaid, B, it's out of alignment as far as an order of operations. And then, and then, and then there's always this thing, it's like in a very high level, energetically high level way, untangling the marketing from what the thing actually does. Because we can, and we could just say, you know, PMF devices, which is one of the things we were mentioning, which I absolutely love. And it's been.

imperative for my healing journey. It supported my detoxification and drainage pathways. It will not fix a cell membrane when you're breathing and mold every single day. It will not fix long-term the threat that your body is experiencing from outside world. There's a big old red blinking, you know, alarm in your living room or in your dryer connection or in a wall that where you had a leak.

Right? You've learned how water moves through a house when there's a leak and we got to get that first. Those other things are going to come down the road, you know, and depending on the fabric of it, you know, I'd hate for you to buy a really nice sauna that's made out of like some fabric that is going to be embedded with these spores. And then the thing you bought to make you well is going to start making you sick. So I'd never, I don't want you to waste your money.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (05:14.026)
Yeah.

Yeah, yes I have.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (05:38.57)
Totally, Yeah, and that's always why I call you, because you're my voice of reason when I'm in one of those moods of what's gonna win? I just need to win. You know, the mold journey, I'm very impressed at how not sick I am for the level of testing I've now done. I have done the full mold assessment on the home, remediated. Then my intuition and my body this summer said something is still off, because all my hair started falling out of my head. And I was like, well, that's a sign.

And I went to a functional medicine doc. goes, Shivani, you're still living in mold. And I said, no, I'm not. I won. She goes, everyone thinks they win, and no one's winning. Call my mold dog guy. So I had a mold dog come through. That dog found so many new issues and put me in the mood to just rip it all out, which is good and bad. You have to be pretty, like, you have to be a little cognizant and a little bit.

conservative in what you do with that mold dog idea. But I went for it, ripped out more things, found new problems, new mold assessment, newer mediation. So we're almost on the other side of the project. But one AC leak and one door leak really did a number on this house. And everyone around me is like, buy a new house. I'm like, are you people insane? Like, who just buys a new home? You have to fix it, because any home could have these issues. But I do think that I'm lucky, lucky as all heck, because

My children are not truly sick. They have mild symptoms like headaches and allergies. I am not sick. I feel phenomenal. I'm in the middle of a book launch enjoying my best life. So I truly attribute us coming through unscathed with Ayurvedic wisdom, addressing inflammation, being addicted to the lifestyle that I teach around health. So I feel lucky.

Freddie Kimmel (07:26.262)
You are lucky. You are very lucky. And I want to say a couple of things for listeners at home is that it's very possible that your genetic profile is such that you are a little more robust at removing environmental toxins than the normie. And that'd be part of the story. Another part of the story is that you don't eat the standard American diet. There's a level of awareness.

around food, around hydration, sense of purpose. You know, we often find these things with, there's a couple or a hundred co-factors and we can say, look, here's what I want, here's what I want people to hear. Just because Dr. Shivani had the experience of a really, and if, do you post that on your Instagram or your Facebook? Instagram.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (08:20.607)
Instagram.

Freddie Kimmel (08:22.432)
If you've seen some of the photos and the remediation and Kotter stories, we are talking about some pretty wild instances of the home barrier outside home, inside home being compromised with water damage and some black mold. So it's pretty severe. You know, I've seen people with little patches be very sick. One patch behind a shower installation, whereas you had multiple factors. But just because you got through it with

Dr. Shivani Gupta (08:46.368)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (08:52.072)
not losing your job or being bedridden or doesn't mean that that's somebody else's story. Right? We can always look at the evidence and we can look at the experience. We can look at the person and we can look at the profile, your risk profiles, as far as genetics and lifestyle. And we can create a story. Everybody's going to be different going through this. Everybody. And you, there's no way to say, unless I have a complete comprehensive walkthrough from mold.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (09:11.924)
Yeah, for sure.

Freddie Kimmel (09:21.28)
inflammation markers, co-infections, organ function, all these other things that are going to play into the severity of your experience. Right?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (09:30.398)
Sure, and I will say this, I'm a huge fan of functional medicine. I've been going to functional medicine for five years. And in the last year, the testing came out shit show levels bad. Like every functional medicine doctor I've talked to is like, this result doesn't match up with what I see on the internet. So either you're lying and every story you post about what you eat and do is a lie, or you're doing all the good things, but what's happening underneath the surface is not good.

and they're all trying to supplement me, peptide me, support me. And so the minute I got the mycotox result, I was like, okay. That would explain why underneath the surface we are battling a battle here. I'm just, thankfully, I teach this work, I live the Ayurvedic lifestyle. So thankfully my level of self care is so high. I'm able to kind of mitigate that in between so I'm not physically experiencing it.

but it's not like the body isn't paying quite a price. And so I am fully committed to functional medicine and doing all the things right now because as soon as we're done with mold, I will have to do the really good work of detoxing and winning. So yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (10:42.806)
Yeah. The other thing I just want to mention for audiences at home is that when we experience rapid hair loss, the incident on the metabolic side could have been six to four months prior that you took the big hit. So that's also something to consider. It's just within the bigger picture, right? And as far as these timelines, it doesn't mean you got exposed to something yesterday with hair loss.

us. Hair takes a while, right? And it's, we can think about it like this way. There's two schools of thought, which again, I'm not a scientist, I am a citizen scientist, but I'm not a doctor, that metabolically, the body could be clearing hair in a way to get more energy in. It's like, where is where gets a lot of sun exposure, you know, the light to bring in and support myocardial function is our

really are face and head if we're clothed all day and the body can make way. That can be one area. It can also say, the body hyper intelligent. What, what can I down regulate as far as a process that I need right now? Do I need hair or do I need, do I need kidney and adrenal function is my liver or my liver enzymes, like through the roof. So hair, although important on to some degree in the modern world.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (11:43.008)
sure.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (11:59.84)
Right?

Freddie Kimmel (12:10.2)
We don't have body hair like people used to, you know, 10,000 years ago. You know, we're living in comfortable 72 degree controlled boxes. So I just want to put that in scope and I'm glad you have everything identified.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (12:24.938)
Yeah, I haven't identified Freddie, but this is why I call you quarterly. I'm like, Freddie, this is the new problem. My hair is falling out of my head. I remember I called you this summer and you're like, Shwani, it could have been four to six months ago. And then I tied that to February. February, I was in the middle of the mold project, opening up way too many things at once and was so exposed to it. But yeah, it's one of those journeys where I think the problem with mold is how dysregulating it is. It puts you into such a state of fear.

Freddie Kimmel (12:33.325)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (12:51.479)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (12:54.006)
And so I'm constantly having to tell myself, we're not going to dream about mold. We're not going to stress about mold. We're almost going to cross the finish line. But it's almost like the monster under the bed where once you know, like until you expose every wall, until you expose everything, you have this new awareness that mold could be anywhere. It could be in any hotel room. Now when I get in a hotel room, I'm like, oh, how did you maintain this place? I don't trust you. You look in stores, you notice leaks.

I know it's leaks now in every store. In the gyms, I'll look up and I'll see leaks. So now I have this horrible awareness. But my conclusion based on that awareness is you should have very healthy cell membranes. You need to win it in inflammation and oxidation. Put a lifestyle in place so you're resilient. And guess what? You're going to see and experience this crap for the rest of your life. You can't let it dysregulate you. You have to show up and say, you know what? I'm really healthy. So it'll be fine.

Freddie Kimmel (13:27.086)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (13:51.658)
So that's kind of the last piece of the mold journey that I think will be the last point to kind of move on from.

Freddie Kimmel (13:58.583)
Yeah. And, and I will say this, like you've mentioned, we don't control outside world. What do we have control over? A little bit internally, right? It's like, what are the choices I make every single day that are a practice? You know, this concept that's come over again, it's like every week I say it, was like, health is a skill that we work on and we develop over time and we never quit unless we want to lose that competitive edge.

And that's like, man, if you can get that in check, there's going to be so many doors and avenues open to you in your life. But if we're always fighting for word recall and energy and just the sense, if there is an overlying sense of like, man, it's just this, it's just not working like it used to, then we got to start asking some better questions.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (14:50.454)
And whenever I hang out with my friends, those are the big complaints. I have brain fog. I can't remember names. I can't remember things. I'm so tired. I don't want to work out. Every evening I sit down and I just can't get up and do anything else. I don't feel the same. I keep gaining weight. Losing weight is so much harder now. And I look at all these women, I'm like, that's perimenopause and that's inflammation. And if we're going to cross every decade inflamed, guys,

this is gonna keep happening and you're gonna keep saying, I guess this is just aging and I'm gonna look at you and say, it's not just aging, you have full control over this, let's go. And so that's why I wrote my new book, cause I was like, if people don't understand that inflammation is the root cause issue underneath all of this, the driving force, how are we ever gonna win at our health? We're gonna keep blaming aging and think aging is the problem and it's not the problem, we're the problem.

Freddie Kimmel (15:44.568)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (15:45.522)
our behaviors, our activities, our rituals. And so that's why I wrote the whole book and that's why I studied. I'm so grateful I found Ayurveda and studied it. To me, Ayurvedic medicine is this profound system of health and healing that gives us a toolkit. And then when you fuse it with the incredible wisdom that you bring, you bring so much knowledge around modern tech, all the tools, all the toys that exist. It's actually this beautiful fusion because the ancient wisdom shows you the free, inexpensive, easy.

ritualistic way to bring it into your life. And I think the message you always share is please start there, guys. It's there. And then let's enhance with these great tools that can enhance the effects that we're looking for and help us get to those goals faster.

Freddie Kimmel (16:28.972)
That's right. That's right. It's so true. There's a couple really beautiful things you said there. Wait, before we go forward, what is the title of your new book?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (16:38.164)
The new book is called The Inflammation Code. It's a Hay House book coming out and it's all about inflammation and Ayurveda and super spices.

Freddie Kimmel (16:47.746)
The inflammation code. I, inflammation is, inflammation is a good one too.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (16:55.274)
Yeah, it is, it is. And because it really explains that it's not aging, it's inflammation. And people underestimate it. I meet people all the time who are like, I have pain, I have joint pain. I just wake up and I'm so stiff. And that's just how it is now. And I always look at them like, anytime your brain says, I guess this is how it is due to aging, that is your cue. It even happens to me. I'm going through that season with mold. The other day I woke up, I was like, well, my knee hurts, my hip hurts.

I'm tired. I guess this is just how it is now. As soon as I say that in my mind, I'm like, nope, that's inflammation. You have complete power and complete control over that. What changed in the last week that you feel that way? I'm like, I worked out less. I slept late and I've been eating out a lot. Okay, cool. Reverse out of that right now. You have complete control.

Freddie Kimmel (17:46.092)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (17:49.847)
Yeah, a hundred percent. was saying that, I was saying in this assignment I did this last couple of weeks, I've been doing a website redesign and, know, I'm trying to niche down and, and with this web designer, we're talking about, she's like, what do you do? What do you do? I was like, I really help people reclaim resilience and vitality. And it's by weaving the cutting edge wellness technology, the ancient healing practices and the guiding principles of nature.

So those last two are, they're so strong, nature functions in a rhythm. Things, phrases like a tree was not meant to fruit in all four seasons. There is a time for deep rest. There's a time to go inside and literally lose your, all the trees are losing their leaves right now. Right, they are not fruit, we're not growing apples right now in the season. The apples are falling off the tree and turning into mush and turning into fertilizer.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (18:18.731)
Mm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (18:25.472)
Yes.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (18:40.182)
Right?

Freddie Kimmel (18:46.666)
We too go through cycles, you know, and, and, and because we're in this hyper unconscious capitalist society that is like produce, produce, produce. I just, I just talked to a really good friend this morning that is going to come down to an event we're hosting in, in Austin. And she's telling me about her book and her platform and her team. And I just said, how are you doing this right now? How are you doing this? How are you doing this?

Is it, do you have support? What does that structure look like? It was so great to hear. She's like, my God, Freddie, it's so great. I'm actually less busy than I've ever been because now my role, my function is just focusing on the education of this one thing. Right. I'm just going to talk about this one thing. And I've, I've by, by the blessing of the product being success, I've been able to have people step in and run the company. So now I can just educate.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (19:21.845)
Nice.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (19:30.39)
Right? Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (19:45.524)
Yeah, I'm in that.

Freddie Kimmel (19:45.75)
What a great spot.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (19:48.66)
It's true. I'm in that position too. I built my supplement company 10 years ago and it's been a labor of love and the first seven years were rough and I was very alone. And then with these amazing mentors who came in, great friends, great people, we really shifted my role. I'm CEO, but really I'm just chief educator. My whole job is online to teach on podcasts and I love it. And my other job is to speak on stage, which I love. And the whole team.

Freddie Kimmel (19:53.741)
Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (20:18.044)
Talk about an incredible team. They are running the entire show. So there's weeks I'm traveling. I'm not here. I don't have to touch it. There's weeks I say, guys, I'm on podcast five days this week. They're like, don't worry. We don't need to see you. We're good. We know the drill. We're running the systems. yeah, it's interesting. When you do a book launch, you get so zoned in on one thing.

Freddie Kimmel (20:30.296)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (20:40.308)
And there's nothing you really can't focus on much else. It's a very all consuming thing. So anyone who's done it knows like you are, you have only one goal. And because you get so distilled into that one focus, it's almost meditative because you have to push everything else aside. Now granted in a mold journey, managing home reconstruction while being a podcaster, while being on podcasts isn't the easiest thing. But for me, I teach the Ayurvedic circadian rhythm.

And so I think of my life as seasons. And like you said, we all have a season when we're supposed to completely be reclusive and take our time and be quiet. For me, that's the summer season, because my constitution is called Bitta, I'm a fire. And so in the summer, I will downshift. And even though my team is like, no, we want you productive, we want you here. I'm like, you want me productive? The majority of the year, you have to give me my off season. Think of me like an athlete.

I take a season to not be on camera, to not be public facing, to go travel with my children and recuperate and regenerate. And that's what I need to function. And without it, I have seen every year I will burn out. I will crash hard. It's a shit show basically. And so I very much as an entrepreneur have learned, live by your constitution, live by your elemental design, build your circadian rhythm. Nature's rhythm wins above all.

You can try to defy it as much as you can, but you will not win. And so I always take my summer and chill. And that's one of my best ideas come through. I can write a book in the summer. It's not going to happen in the other nine months of the year when I'm so forward facing and camera facing and all these things.

Freddie Kimmel (22:21.472)
Yeah, so true, so true. Let's talk about the inflammation code. And if, go ahead, you go.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (22:29.568)
So I, yeah, go ahead. So I wrote this book and it was a dream. To me, it's a dream to write a book for Hay House. That's like the first piece to even be chosen. The second piece to that is I've always had this dream of teaching Ayurvedic wisdom in a way people could use. So I do it so much online, but to have the chance to sit and write it out as like the six pillars with the recipes, with a 14 day plan.

Like that too has been such a joy because the whole point of the book is Ayurveda gave us a beautiful lifestyle that we can build into our lives in a great rhythm that helps us build consistency. And when we do those practices, we can win at that chronic low grade inflammation. That's a forest fire within us. It's basically burning the house down and we don't see it. And that's the big thing I recognize with mold this year is you never know.

what is actually burning the house down from within. And if you don't catch it in time and you don't address it in time, sometimes it can do so much damage. And that's why in my family growing up, I would show up to India every year to see my grandparents and someone would pass away from quadruple bypass, stroke, heart attack. We had Parkinson's, leg amputation or cancer. And every time I showed up, I was like, guys, is this my genetics? Is this coming for me?

Freddie Kimmel (23:48.75)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (23:53.896)
Is this gonna happen to all our parents, all my siblings and cousins? Like, what is this? And when I realized it was inflammation as the root cause of all these preventable metabolic diseases, I thought, okay, how can you not have an equation? That's why it's called the inflammation code. There is a code to winning at inflammation. We just have, like you said, completely broken that lifestyle that we all led in ancient times. We all lived in a great rhythm. We all understood how to honor food.

how to ignite a gut digestive fire, how to live according to our circadian rhythms, how to live according to our individual elemental design and constitution, and then also how to win at what I now coined as mental inflammation. In the book, when I was sitting there to write it, I thought, okay, well, I'm gonna teach people all this stuff. But many of us are already pretty health obsessed and we actually do a lot of work. When I meet women in their 40s, 50s, 60s, they're like, I eat clean, I work out, I lift, I yoga, I pilates.

I eat my protein, I take my protein shakes and my fiber, like the list goes on and on. And I thought, just as I was finishing the book, I was like, how do I explain to people that if we're gonna stress out the whole time about everything we do that's good, and we stress out about everything else in life, that mental inflammation alone is gonna cause the systemic inflammation that's gonna harm us anyway. And so that was kind of the final thesis of the book was.

We have to win at that too guys, or we won't get to have the health that we want.

Freddie Kimmel (25:26.518)
Yeah, so true. So true. So where do people, if they're interested, you know, I'm always like, well, what's my inflammation profile? You know, and then what then what is the protocol to start mitigating some of these? Almost like my my dashboard, right? You know, what is it? Is it is it increasing servings of oily fish? Is it fasting? Is it hydration? Like, where do you people

start, what is like an inflammation dashboard?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (26:01.504)
You know what's interesting? Most people don't even do good blood work. So I would start there. I mean, if when you go to the doctor and you're asking for your blood work, ask for HSCRP, ask them to do deeper testing so you can even see how inflamed you are. Most people don't even have that basic number to base off of. But if you don't have time resources, if you're not doing it that way, if you're not gonna go get the blood work.

Listen to your body and look at what your symptoms are. Like I mentioned with those inflammation type of symptoms. Anytime the body has chronic daily pain, chronic fatigue, chronic headaches, chronic bloating, chronic gut issues, anything like that is your check engine light going off in your body. And it's time to pause and say, hey, what is this? Where is this coming from? Do I need deeper testing?

Do I need to go to functional medicine, get a stool test? Do I need to go to the doctor and get this checked out? Most people don't realize how insidious inflammation is because those check engine lights are a little bit subtle. They can be going off and you don't quite realize that it's like a full blown big issue that's brewing and storming in the system. And so I usually start there with people. I go through a big, big intake of like, what's going on? And my mind is always like, all right, well, that's definitely inflammation. Now let's look at how we're gonna win at the inflammation.

And what I also think is most of us are inflamed because we underestimate the number of things causing inflammation in the first place. Could be environmental toxins, could be diet. We think of diet, but secondhand smoke could be any virus or bacteria that comes along. Could be pH balance in the body. Could be how we're cooking, not just what we're eating, but are we eating food that's grilled and charred?

and causing carcinogens? Is it fried? Is it seed oils? Is it the fact that it's processed? So I have a whole chart that I present at a lot of conferences on like these are all the things that cause inflammation. Environmental toxins could be acid rain, could be that serious stuff, but it could be your water quality and air quality. It's what you're consuming. And so if all of those things could be causing inflammation in the system,

Dr. Shivani Gupta (28:11.866)
I honestly believe that 99.9 % of us are at some level inflamed in this moment in time from something, mold can cause it, then what is that end result? It's build this lifestyle that will keep you winning at inflammation. Build the lifestyle that'll keep you uninflamed. We have to build an anti-inflammatory lifestyle.

Freddie Kimmel (28:32.416)
Is that something you walk people through in the book, the deeper layer of testing as far as awareness? What are the inflammation markers that you'd love to look at?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (28:41.204)
I do, I find that most people who I meet don't want to go to functional medicine and do the big deeper testing. I do tell everyone, go to your doctor, look for these numbers. We need to know where we stand in front of, in terms of like omega-3, omega-6 balance, HSCRP, cholesterol is a good number to indicate, A1C can indicate. So all these things, when everything's coming out elevated, that also is a sign of inflammation. So I do talk about, look, you need to get tested to know, but also,

look at the body and understand symptomatically. Ancient Ayurveda always looked at someone and could say, okay, I can tell. I can tell you're inflamed. I can tell you're a little swollen. can tell something is off in the system and let's then do the work.

Freddie Kimmel (29:24.672)
Yeah, just like a Chinese medicine practitioner, if anybody's ever been to an acupuncturist, we're looking at the colors of the tongue, the inside of the mouth, colors under the eyes. There is, there are signals. I do think it's a really interesting time. was listening to, do you know Dr. Mike? He's like really big on social media right now.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (29:34.806)
That's it. Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (29:48.416)
think I do. I must recognize him.

Freddie Kimmel (29:49.513)
Mike. Let me see that I'm not... You do probably, Dr. Mike. He's really interesting. Really interesting. Let me just make sure. Dr. Mike. He's really grounded. However, I will tell you there are some times... I'm not sure. I never know if it's somebody... Obviously, he's got millions of followers. 5.1 million. He's not making social media content.

He has a team, right? He has a team. And you know, there's been a couple times where he's come in a little harsh for me on patients walking into a doctor and saying, I want this testing. I want my hormones testing. And he had just had a woman on who again, I'm not not very aligned with, but she had just said, you know, women should not be asking for their hormones to be tested. We're doctors, we know.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (30:19.478)
Hmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (30:34.646)
True. Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (30:45.366)
Bye.

Yeah, I addressed that in my book. I said we are sovereign and we must advocate for our health. actually just read the whole book for audible, so it's so fresh in my mind. And I really like tripled down on the fact that my whole life has been a life of sickness and frustration because all I did was listen to doctors for the first 20 years of my life. Funny turn of fate that I married a doctor and I'm married into a mega family of surgeons now and.

All I do is say, you need to show up to your doctor's office so educated, so aware. And if the doctor doesn't feel like they align with you, finish your appointment with respect. I've always finished my appointments with respect. Walk out and find the next one. Because we need the doctor who's gonna partner with us, be on our team and advocate for us. How can someone say the patient shouldn't walk in and ask for testing? The patient's coming in and saying, I need more data on myself. This is my body.

I need more information and I'm asking you to help me get it. So I find that so frustrating.

Freddie Kimmel (31:49.047)
Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's a tough spot, right? it's a tough spot. I understand. can understand a doctor, you know, another practitioner was telling me that while they were, and this is a story from a friend of a friend. and they said in the, in the office there, while they were doing the consult with mom, the child is next to the, to the patient chat, GPT, everything she's recommending and then offering, what about this test?

And what about this? And she goes, you know, it's a really tricky time to do medicine because we have this new way to source information, which is imperfect at this stage now, but it's possible that, you know, a super learning computer system can have a higher level of awareness than your medical practitioner.

I think the danger is, is that we do give it over to, and I'll say this again, and Reed Davis says this great, and Evan Transu says this great, we can't treat lab results. You are not your labs. The labs are snapshots in time based on the last hundreds years in medicine, which every 50 years we jump forward and we say, my God, I can't believe we were basing this diagnosis on this level when...

This one is tied to these five over here is tied to these types. So long answer. We have to listen to our patients. We have to listen to people advocating for themselves. I don't wanna share the other story because it's again, it's like we can always make a story around it. But if somebody comes into your office and says, I don't feel good.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (33:29.846)
Sure.

Freddie Kimmel (33:34.935)
I want to do something different. And they said, you don't, you don't understand hormones. What I see looks fine right now. We're going to do this a lot of times that that practitioner practitioners are not going to take, they're not going to take ownership of all the things you're talking about in the inflammation code. So I want to move to this light. What are the things we should be doing that are often steps we are skipping as far as lifestyle awareness to manage this inflammation profile?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (34:05.974)
For sure, and I will say this, being married into an all-doctor family, I hang out with them a lot. And I do find, to share the other side of that equation, they know they're at lane and they are worried about us. Like I'm surrounded by people who love their patients and want to do good care. And their lane is their lane and their job is to protect us. Their job is to prevent us from generating some further down the line problem. So they're gonna use the toolkit they have in the way that they are allowed to use it according to standard of care.

to treat us. And so that's also something I explained in the book was, look, you're dealing with someone who can function in this much space, you might have something more complex. That's usually when people find functional medicine, Ayurvedic medicine, homeopathic, naturopathic, chiropractic, right? When we seek bigger complex answers, we're looking for someone who widens the toolkit than our gastro doc or our heart doc or whatever the specialty is. And so I kind of like to bring that awareness of

Let's not blame the doctor. They are doing the best they can within the lane that they are allowed to function within. I can't go to my OB and be like, you please order my cardiac test? He's not supposed to do that. You have to kind of go to the one who's dealing with that lane. So yes, in the book, my dream was to show everyone how to build the Ayurvedic lifestyle into their own lifestyle as a rhythm. And that means one big pillar is the circadian rhythm. And we talk about that so much in the biohacking space.

But Ayurveda took it to much deeper level. We taught that different energetics of the elements constitute different times of day. So for example, Pitta time of day. Pitta, which we pronounce in the West, Pitta. Pitta time of day is fire time of day. So that's 10 to two on the clock. Just like the sun is highest in the sky at noon, in Ayurveda, 10 to two is when you're most productive. That fire is on, that brain is on.

You're the most supported for that lunchtime meal to absorb the highest level of nutrition into your system. So if you're gonna eat foods that are harder for you to digest, let's say it's nuts, seeds, some of those super foods we love jamming into everything, do that at lunchtime. That's when you're supported for that. And then at night, that 10 to two on the clock is when that circadian clock, your body's gonna clear the body. That fire is gonna be used to clear the lymphatic system, clear out inflammation and help you win at your health.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (36:31.99)
And so that's why in the biohacking space, we talk so much, in longevity space now, saying 10 to two, make sure you're sleeping 10 to two. That's an Ayurvedic concept, teaching that that's your fifth o'clock. And so many people I meet say, you know what, I stay up late. I can't do your 10 to two idea. And I'm like, no worries. You're just taking the same fire and you're leveraging it towards your brain and you're leveraging it towards getting things done. I get it. I do that sometimes. I'll be up till 11. I'm like, gosh, I could just stay up another hour and do so much.

And then I tell myself, no, no, no, no, you're going to use it for sleep. You're going to use it for healing and clearing the system. I'll make sure I go to bed. And so that's just an example of how in Ayurveda we show people how to use their different times of day for better. So for example, even six to 10 PM, we call that Gafa time of day. In the West you pronounce it Kafa. And so that time of day, we're actually meant as the sun sets, our behavior is actually meant to be winding down as well.

But how many of us, because we have blue light and we can do whatever we want, we like in certain seasons, I can work more in the six to 10 season. Once the kids are settled, I've had my dinner. like, I gained another three hours of work. But the same time is meant to be used to wind down the body to encourage a better night's sleep. And so it's almost a decision. Which way do you want to go? Do you want to focus on your health and building the rhythm that actually supports true health? Or do you want to constantly defy nature's clock?

And then do you find that with your health, you're swimming upstream against the river of life, as opposed to just downstream with ease? And so that's really the point of these different rituals and rhythms is to show us we have the power, we can build a rhythm and a pattern in our day. Even if we go three days, four days, if we go five days, two days, you can play with it. I'm not asking for perfection. But if we learn to practice these rhythms, all of a sudden what we're gonna see is more ease in the body.

We're gonna see that the body has the ability to clear inflammation and to heal itself. Your podcast is a beautifully broken podcast, right? We think of our bodies as broken and unable to heal and we need to go take something. We need to take an NSAID to win an inflammation. We need to go take something outside. But we don't need anything extrinsic. It's intrinsic, it's right here. It's as simple as tea time is me time and simple rituals that will help us win.

Freddie Kimmel (38:52.514)
That's right. That's right. I couldn't agree more that 10 to two, you know, that 10 to two window that really resonates with me, you know, you're saying we have this window of cellular repair and protein regeneration and autophagy and glymphatic drainage that, you know, you can, we can all do a self assessment and be like, well, wait, I rewatched season one of Ted Lasso last night to 1130.

So I cost myself an hour and a half of good brain drain. Whatever your window is, right? I've always heard the hours before midnight in deep sleep are twice as beneficial.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (39:33.567)
twice.

Correct. Correct. And that's Ayurvedic wisdom is that 10 to 2 window is your support. And what's beautiful is when I was sitting to write the book, I had to pull a lot of science to prove the points and Hay House demands that there's a citation for every claim you make. So I sat there and read so much science last year as I wrote it. We have so much science on the circadian clock, on circadian clock genes. mean, the fact that Western medicine has proven without a doubt across the spectrum.

Freddie Kimmel (39:38.382)
twice as beneficial.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (40:04.544)
how much of Ayurvedic wisdom is valid to me is incredible. So we know our genes and our cells are functioning on the circadian clock, yet we also think that Netflix and chill is appropriate after 10. When we know full well what our cells want us to do, our cells want us to heal, they want us to clear, they want that glymphatic waste to be cleared out. And we're like, nah, I got work to do.

I'm gonna Instagram. I'm gonna do the bad things that I wanna do.

Freddie Kimmel (40:35.394)
That's right. That's right. And there is, I also want to speak to the percentage of the population that does not have that option. There are plenty of families. We had mentioned how the economy, experientially has changed. I understand we're at all time highs in gold.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (40:41.942)
Sure.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (40:46.837)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (40:55.95)
Troubleshoot. we're having issues reaching our server. Please verify your internet connection. Troubleshoot.

Freddie Kimmel (41:14.126)
System connectivity. What a bummer.

Freddie Kimmel (41:20.429)
that's working.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (41:58.55)
There you are, okay. You got cut off at minute 40. You're starting with like the airline people basically, or people who work at night.

Freddie Kimmel (42:07.61)
Yeah, so interesting. just, don't know what happened. It was like, we're having trouble connecting with our server. I just marked that clip. So hopefully we'll be good. And wait, let me just see. Okay. It's uploading our past content. So I was saying, what about the people that don't have the option of honoring the perfect circadian clock? Cause there are many families out there. We mentioned the downturn in the economy and the real, the, the rubber meets the road. Many people are working multiple jobs.

where they're raising families, they're getting kids off to school, they're putting food on the plate, right? A lot of times that 10 to two into the wee hours is working a second job or a second passion project to be able to break out of the system. What do we do? What's the advice?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (42:54.196)
You know, it's tough. It's tough because I RV that said 10 to 2. I do find sometimes as a mother it takes time to get through the day. The chores, everything many nights. It's closer to 11 when I go to bed. And so for me it's about how can I use my weekends? How can I use? So for that person I would say whatever nights you can give yourself as much of that sleep as possible. Do it where you can start asking for help. A lot of times we're not asking for help.

friends, family, whoever, wherever you can build efficiency into the day. So I found for myself, for example, I was wasting a lot of time around four to six. I was trying to help the kids with homework and do things. And I finally realized, you know what? No one actually needs me from four to six. So why don't I do everything that I normally do from eight to 10, 11, and get all that done earlier in the day, just with the awareness that in my case, I know I need to detox. This is my year of mold. Sleep is much more non-negotiable for my health and my brain.

So if I need to honor sleep that seriously for my health, where can I push as much into my day and into my weekends as I can so that I can get that sleep? So it's just about doing the best you can. I know we can't be perfect at it and get perfect sleep. It's not easy, but all the nights when you can do it, where can you build sleep hygiene rituals, sleep rituals from IRB that we teach about supporting better sleep? So let's say you're gonna sleep later.

Can you take a hot shower or an Epsom salt bath or dry brush or even just walk for 10 minutes in the evening or have a tea that puts the mind at ease so that the sleep quality improves? So I'm a big believer in making whatever you can work. We don't have to be perfect. This ancient wisdom is actually very forgiving. It believes in moderation, not in perfection or extremes on either side. And so I'm a big believer in you have the power to build a ritual that builds your health.

and that's really custom to you. Sleep is important, but let's figure out how you can get that quality sleep when you can get it.

Freddie Kimmel (44:53.106)
Yeah. I mean, I've, I've always been a person who practices like a non-sleep deep rest. I'll, I'll say, you know, midday between it's probably between two and three 45 is that I will often call out as I will say, Cynthia, I am going to meditate now and I will have my version of not falling asleep per se. Sometimes I pass out, but I will put on like a little now I do, I do the Freddie version, right? So I'm going to do a biofeedback headset.

Maybe I'm gonna do some hydrogen nebulized gas, but I'm gonna do 20 minutes of a guided meditation where I'm letting my body come back into a place of be like, let's take all the adrenaline and all the dopamine hits that have built up to this midday peak. And I'm gonna honor the downturn that does happen naturally midday. There's great vocal guided, it's called NSDR, they're on Spotify, non-sleep.

deep rest, which is shown to be incredibly beneficial for resetting that midday clock.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (45:53.045)
Nice.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (45:57.302)
That's awesome. I teach it as tea time is me time. So I have alarms on my phone at 10.30. I have one that goes off at 3.30 and the 3.30 says high tea and snack. And so I'll pause at different times of day and have a cup of tea. And that's my anchor to myself to remind myself, hey, you need to chill out. You need to take a minute, tune inwards, no phone, no distractions, no one else.

And what I do is I take that time, and we know drinking a hot beverage is beneficial for dropping into our parasympathetic nervous system. It's gonna calm us down. You can't chug hot tea, unfortunately. So you're gonna have to take a second and sip on it, and that alone will calm the nervous system. And then I take that moment to ask my intuition questions like, how are you doing today? Are you gonna be able to eat dinner today? What do you need to change in this week for this week to be good for you? And that's a pretty powerful question.

Freddie Kimmel (46:29.106)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (46:50.102)
because my system will come back with, need to cancel that, you need to say no, that's going too far for you. And so using that innate inner wisdom that we typically don't leave time for or space for can be really powerful. So I'm tuning into my intuition and then I take that slice of time and I open it. Because most of us say, I don't have time, I don't have time to take my supplements, I don't have time for this, that or the other. But if you can create time, I call it expanding time, I'll expand it and say,

Freddie Kimmel (47:03.056)
Mm-hmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (47:19.454)
one of my alarms is water and supplements. So make sure you take your morning round of supplements, make sure you take your afternoon round of supplements. But tea time is me time is my best way for myself to build these self care anchor points throughout the day. And then I build ritual on top. So that's my reminder of like, okay, what am I also gonna be eating with lunch today to support myself? How am gonna structure my day to be beneficial? Am I walking enough today so my sleep will be good? And so I think we have this opportunity to create time.

if we just understand how to use it. A lot of my clients have been in corporate in the past. I'm like, don't worry. Tea time is me time is easy at work. You're gonna go to the water cooler anyway. Take that tea break as your relaxation. Post lunch, walk for 10 minutes outside your building. I take all my business meetings with my team and we walk around the building because I need to move. I don't wanna sit on my butt all day stagnant. And that's the way we align to circadian rhythm, breathe in nature, move our lymphatic system and move our body more.

Freddie Kimmel (48:09.19)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (48:19.358)
And then we have tea time breaks as well. So I'm all about how do you build tiny little self care rhythms to win at your health and to win at inflammation. And that's what I teach in the book is let's make it quick and easy and doable.

Freddie Kimmel (48:31.12)
I think the thing that I'm really loving you mentioned a couple of times is the word ritual. Many of us do this, right? We'll say, well, what's my favorite drink that feels comforting to my soul? Maybe it's a rare bird, paris, antin coffee, or maybe it's a really nice adaptogenic tea. But when we do the thing and it's right into social media,

or it's trying to, let me quick do the dishes and have the tea. There is no break for the nervous system and that setting of chaos. The high tea time, which you're describing, for me, I'm seeing it be this sacred space in which the only thing I'm honoring is sipping tea and I'm listening to the body. And I really, I can't tell people, like, I know it's, maybe that sounds boring. Maybe it's not a nano-bubbled oxygen bath.

It is so beneficial and so few of us do this. It's like, what is it? I've been more accountable to walking my dog, Mr. Higgs, without the phone. All I'm doing is we're talking to the other dogs. We're waiting for that perfect poop. You know, we're navigating the neighborhood. You know, maybe we're, we're, letting him wander up to an antique set and we're just talking to people. We're looking at nature, but there is no Instagram.

I'm not triggered by whoever is commenting on a video or not commenting or what I'm really present in the moment. And I think that's what that high tea time does. I mean, I will tell you it's been the last six months that the dedicated time meditation every single day or the morning, can be the nano bubbled oxygen bath. That can be my high tea time, but it's without the phone. It's without the other.

Demands from outside world pulling me in 20 different directions and it's just being it is a human being not a human doing doing Love that phrase

Dr. Shivani Gupta (50:33.586)
It's true. I do too. And there's moments where I can feel it. I'm sure people can feel it. I have a thing in my brain where I can tell like, gosh, I'm so stressed out. Or if I'm on my phone too much, like I got a certain amount of pain from being too aware of too many things and worrying about too many things at once. And I have that anguish feeling that comes in. And the minute it happens, I go, that's mental inflammation. Do you want to keep doing that?

Freddie Kimmel (50:41.04)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (50:53.233)
Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (51:02.164)
And my whole body will say no, because I teach inflammation and turmeric all day. I'm like, okay then, stop. Put the phone down. We don't need Instagram. We don't need, you know, 500 million notifications. I have like 500,000 emails sitting at any given time, but I can't even read. It's like, okay, pause, breathe, choose differently. And I'll always choose move in nature. That's like my fastest one to cool my nervous system down. Or I will make tea. have tea five to six times a day.

But I think we have such a choice to recognize what that feeling means. And if we attributed it to inflammation, we would behave differently. And I think that's a really powerful tool too, is recognize when that stress is rising and then say, you know what, I'm gonna choose differently and put it down.

Freddie Kimmel (51:40.369)
Mm-hmm.

Freddie Kimmel (51:49.275)
Yeah. So we've talked about rituals. We've talked about understanding our levels of inflammation. You know, what are some other areas you'd like to point people to that can have some high ROI as far as either a lifestyle, behavioral change, supplementation. We've talked about sleep hygiene a little bit. What else do you love to, again, maybe something we touched on in the book.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (52:12.896)
So in the book, I talk about the Ayurvedic 12 self-care rituals that we can do throughout our day to build a rhythm. And some of those include tongue scraping, which is a great way to detox the body. I teach that all the organs of the body are reflected on the tongue, just like in reflexology, they're reflected on the bottom of the foot. And most people don't know this one, but they'll tell me later, I bought a tongue scraper, Shivani, I use it every day, and now I can feel if I didn't. Like I'll walk out of the bathroom and I'll feel like my mouth is not actually clean yet.

and then they'll use the tongue scraper and then they feel complete. So it ignites digestive fire, gently detoxes all organs, clears what we call ama. Ama is an Ayurvedic term for that toxin residue that forms in the system and contributes to why we are so inflamed. And so I love teaching tongue scraping because you buy one tool for 10 bucks, it lasts you for your whole life. We recommend using a copper tongue scraper, but it could truly be any metal tongue scraper that you use.

And so there was many different rituals like that that we can build into our lives. So self-care is a big one to me. We've used the word ritual a lot. So you know me, I love self-care rituals. And then the other big one is tumeric. In the book, I do talk about how, look, inflammation is a big deal and we do need to build this powerful lifestyle to win at inflammation. I'm a big fan of let's solve it upfront. Let's get the fires down and then let's do the work to build the lifestyle. Because building a lifestyle can take time. It's putting one habit.

and ritual in place, getting good at it, getting fast at it, and then you stack more and more on top. And so turmeric, I'm a big fan of, as you know, and I created a turmeric. So I'm a big fan of like, let's win at the inflammation, let's get that inflammation fire down and then move forward.

Freddie Kimmel (53:55.059)
I love that. I love that and it's it really does take 60 days to bring on a new behavior There's things that I absolutely love that I feel in ROI Heaven above knows why they some of them just don't stick tongue scraping it is you know, it's really wild do a three-day fast and See what your tongue does over time

Dr. Shivani Gupta (54:19.443)
I'm sure it's interesting.

Freddie Kimmel (54:21.482)
my God, it's wild, know, tongue scraping. I'll say like with good hygiene and eating and hydrating the way I eat, I don't notice a lot with the tongue scraping, but if I do a three day fast, the stuff that starts to come out of that organ is wild. It is like pure white. I'm like, what is coming out of my body?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (54:41.92)
That's nuts. That's so cool.

Freddie Kimmel (54:43.544)
It's wild, but it takes time. you know, I think it's, you can only add in one or two things at a time.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (54:53.45)
I know it's hard. I'm trying to add in like 10 at all times and my body's like, no, sorry. We have to be kind. We have to be sympathetic. I've been told like a lot of mold protocols this year. And then I'm kind of laughing at myself at how badly I'm implementing them. And I'm like, what's wrong with you? Why can't you just do all the things? It's like, can't pick up 18 new habits at once. How about it's one at a time? And truly that's the Ayurvedic way is understand that this is one body.

Freddie Kimmel (54:59.472)
Yeah.

Freddie Kimmel (55:11.824)
nothing's wrong with you.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (55:21.504)
Goal is mind, body, spirit and alignment. We can only do that gradually. It's not an overnight success kind of thing.

Freddie Kimmel (55:28.346)
Yeah, yeah, amen. Where can people get the book?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (55:33.568)
For sure. So the website for the book is theinflammationcode.com and then all the other information about the book will be on my website at drshivani.com.

Freddie Kimmel (55:44.199)
TheInflammationCode.com. wait, I must've typed it wrong. TheInflammationCode.com. Is that live? Okay, great, let me Google this. Let me Google this just to see. We will put that link in the show notes. Is the book available now or can people pre-order or when can they even get a copy?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (55:46.251)
Yes.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (55:55.007)
It is live.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (56:03.305)
Awesome.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (56:11.08)
It's ready, it's live, it's available for pre-order and it'll ship on February 3rd, 2026.

Freddie Kimmel (56:17.778)
Mm, that is my birthday. Yeah, I see it on different areas, Booktopia, Penguin, Walmart, Amazon, I see a link on Amazon. so we can pre-order right on Amazon. That's great, we will put a link in the show notes. That's gonna be amazing. And I always, I wanna do this too.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (56:20.178)
Nice.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (56:30.239)
It's ready to go.

Freddie Kimmel (56:45.41)
Since we have last podcast, you gifted me with the best nighttime tea that I absolutely love and appreciate its flavors just for down reg. You've also gifted me with some inflammation release as well as turmeric gold, which I've done a beautiful, I did a scientific walkthrough from what are the processes that these supplements target?

What's the ROI? I definitely, definitively noticed a change in how my body feels after doing the inflammation relief. That one was gold for me. And it's, know, two caps, maybe once or twice a day. I have a question for you. When, how do you tell people to cycle?

with turmeric. And if you haven't heard our initial podcast, we did the deep dive on turmeric and its role in the body and Ayurvedic and why it's important. But how do you tell people to use this? Cause you know, I don't want to go to the gym every day. don't want to, I don't want to do ice baths every day. I don't want to run a marathon every day. I need time in between these therapies. How do we cycle turmeric?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (57:37.686)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (58:01.014)
Good question. So turmeric is so well received by the body, right? We absorb it so well, the body utilizes it well, it sends it where it needs to go. Over the last 10 years of owning my supplement company, what I have seen is a lot of people take it every single day because then they don't have to take whatever else they're taking for their joint pain or their inflammation. So I've seen two sides of this. I've seen one where people take it consistently every day. And after a few months,

the big issues got resolved. Let's say it's like hip pain, back pain, bigger things. Then it moves into medium size issues. And then they'll call me and they'll say, my gingivitis is gone. That's so weird. Nothing else was helping with that. So it'll go from big to small. And so that's where you get like a true believer who wants to take it forever every day. And to that person, I'll say, look, six out of seven days is good. You can take it for three months, but then take a week off. Like we should cycle through things. We don't have to take them every day forever.

Freddie Kimmel (58:41.202)
Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (59:00.148)
Now the majority of people never take anything every day. I'm one of those people. I definitely forget my supplements at least once or twice a week. I'm running around, I didn't carry them with me. So inevitably for me, I am cycling through and I know that. But for those who are that incredible regimented crew of people who know how to do something daily, I do tell them, look, you can't take something every day forever. Cycle in and through.

Freddie Kimmel (59:23.164)
Beautiful. I found that to be very beneficial. And like you, I'm actually in the process of, building a Google sheet for myself, what I'm taking, how long I'm gonna do this before I reassess. But then I just drew labs with a new practitioner, my Kimberly Verbecky, who I love, just about an hour south of Austin, Texas. And now we're gonna do a review this week. So we're gonna see how things that I've been,

Maybe it was something to like boost liver enzymes or gallbladder flow or shift the microbiome or different, you know, adding in a different type of fish oil. We're going to see the impact. And so now we can, we can reassess. So I just think it's important to like know what you're doing. That's also a very, you know, how much does it cost you aside from your time to build a Google sheet? What am I taking? What is the reason I'm taking it?

What's the timeline look like? And not that you have to follow it like a strict ledger, but there is an awareness. And I found seeing it as opposed to opening the cabinet and looking at all the bottles, right? That just there, that's a great step one.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:00:28.182)
It's true.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:00:33.462)
It's true.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:00:38.482)
It is a great step one. know, I just, because of the Mold Project, moved out of my entire pantry and kitchen and had no idea the size of my supplement graveyard. I owned 10 boxes of supplements, full on, not expired, ready. And I thought I should go, I should have a party and give these to all my friends. Cause at conferences I'm giving some cause people are like, try my supplement, I want you to recommend it. Or I'm buying them.

Freddie Kimmel (01:00:49.234)
Mmm.

Yeah, you did.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:01:05.174)
because I love supplements. And I'm like, oh my gosh, your supplement will give me that? Sure, I'll buy it. So I'm sitting on a ton. And then every time I go to a functional medicine doc, I'm giving protocols and I might not finish the protocol. And so like you just said, it's so important to test. So at this point, this year, because Mold is a pretty serious project, I'm on a pretty serious level of protocol and we are watching the blood work. We're testing to see what's working. Because like you said, we're also bio individual. Just because I took official, it doesn't mean it's going to do what I need it to do.

Does my dose need to increase? Do I need to change my behavior? I know for me, turmeric works very well. It does what I need it to do for me, but it's important to keep an eye on those numbers. Where are we from an inflammation standpoint? So yeah, I agree with you. I think it is so important and a spreadsheet kind of helps lay it out and kind of keep us on a track because otherwise we can kind of forget at any given time which ones we're on and why. I find the why the most compelling piece. Right now I know what I'm on and why.

But sometimes I have second stacks and third stacks. I'll have a longevity stack. I'll have a optimization stack. I'll have so many stacks. And then you get overwhelmed because it's just too many. So yeah, I like your idea. Start with the spreadsheet and track.

Freddie Kimmel (01:02:10.5)
Yeah. I love that. I love that. And spreadsheets great. Just everybody remember you can use code beautifully broken. You can get a discount on all the fusionary formulas. We will link that to America as well. And we'll link the book and I cannot wait for February 3rd, my birthday, the launch of this, the inflammation code. And I'm really excited for the next time we meet up at an event.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:02:35.744)
Thank you. So good to see you, Freddie. I always love seeing you.

Freddie Kimmel (01:02:39.236)
So good to see you. Can't wait for the audience to hear this and you will be on again. Big love.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:02:47.328)
Big love, thank you.